I'm not an anarchists, and the states do have the legitimate authority to punish murder. Not one person has ever been murdered as the result of an abortion other than the doctors who were shot by religious zealots, or the women who died in backroom alley abortions by butchers when the state got involved where it has no authority and made laws regarding abortion.
All government at any level derives its limited powers from the consent of the governed, and as such can not have any powers that we as individuals don't have to grant to it. If we were on an island without a government, neither you, nor me, nor anyone else on the island would have any authority to tell a woman whether or not she may or may not have an abortion. None of us has any say in what she does or doesn't do with her own body or any organisms within that body. It doesn't matter if we personally consider a fetus to be a person or not. She alone has SOLE DOMINION over everything in her body whether it's her own organs, a tapeworm, a germ, or a fetus. Nothing inside the body of a human being has any rights regardless of what that organism happens to be. If you consider abortion to be murder, you are free not to get one, but neither you, nor the combined population of the planet earth other than the pregnant woman, has any legitimate say in whether or not she has an abortion or the legitimate authority to punish her for having one. I don't think you should be forced to pay for anyone's abortion, but neither do you have any say in whether or not they have one. The position of the LP is that only the pregnant woman, and nobody else, decides the appropriateness of having an abortion. In otherwords Libertarians are pro-choice. It's not just the platform, it's the default position in all libertarian philosophy. So yes, I do think the state can punish murder. But this has nothing to do with abortion. They are not the same thing and they never will be. They aren't related in the slightest. And if you "think" abortion is murder, that still doesn't give you any authority or right to stop them or punish them. Any claims to the contrary are not libertarian because they violate the SOLE DOMINION clause of our pledge. --- In [email protected], "David Macko" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I agree with you that the fedgov has no Constitutional authority > regarding abortion. > However, unless you are an anarchist, you should agree that state > governments have the authority to punish murder. Some of us think > murders should be punished no matter where they occur, including > the womb of the victim's mother. > > For life and liberty, > David Macko > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Paul" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, October 09, 2005 2:28 PM > Subject: [Libertarian] Re: Will Christian Conservatives blow it now? > > > > Abortion is a good issue to use because it displays whether someone > > will allow emotion to get in the way of their judgement and their > > dedication to the U.S. Constitution and the limitation within it on > > the powers of the U.S. Government. The Federal government has > > absolutely no say in the matter. In fact, neither do the states. > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > >> > >> Will Christian Conservatives blow it now? > >> > >> Justice Sandra Day O'Connor's retirement from the Supreme Court > > heightened > >> the buzz across America. Every news report in the first two hours > > since the > >> announcement linked O'Connor's resignation with the Abortion Issue. > >> > >> Let's keep the bigger picture in focus. Abortion should not be the > > only > >> legal pivot point in the land of the free. A U. S. Supreme Court > > Justice must > >> rule on many more cases than an abortion case that may reach the > > Court some year. > >> > >> O'Connor in retrospective has been an influential voice for liberty, > > limiting > >> the federal government grabbing power. > >> > >> O'Connor wrote the most quoted dissent in the recent eminent domain > > case > >> (Kelo v. New London). O'Connor's dissent in the medical marijuana > > case, > >> empowering the feds' monolithic control of states' medical > > decision-making, will be > >> quoted in the future. > >> > >> In the meantime, the media relentlessly reports only that O'Connor > > was a > >> swing vote on abortion -- and that President Bush now has the chance > > to appoint a > >> pro-life Justice. No doubt Christian conservatives support that > > selective > >> search criterion. > >> > >> But, how many of Christians understand that this is not a case of > > being able > >> to replace a "bad" Justice with a "good" Justice. The fact is, that > > for those > >> who believe in limited federal powers and maximum freedom, O'Connor > > has been > >> a fair and wise Justice. > >> > >> But, if the abortion issue continues to be the major focus of the > >> Liberal-Conservative debate, then we may lose focus on the greater > > legal > >> issues. This obsession means we may get a Justice far less > > liberty-minded, without > >> time-tested, core Constitutional convictions, needed to sustain debate. > >> [Think Harriet Miers.] > >> > >> So, while obsessing on abortion, Christian conservatives may cut off > > their > >> noses to spite their proud faces for many years, even decades to > > come. They may > >> be so pre-occupied with their present, single-issue focus that they > > may end up > >> sacrificing more than 30 years of hard fought for freedoms in the > > culture > >> war. > >> > >> Failure to focus on the long-term timeline now, reminds us of the > >> metaphorically foolish mother, who throws the baby out with the bath > > water, because she > >> is fixated on expediency and wants a clean house, right now. > > Forgetting future > >> decades would be a supreme (court) irony for those who are planning for > >> Eternity. > >> > >> Are Christian conservatives resigning on this issue prematurely? > >> > >> WRF > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Fair play? Video games influencing politics. Click and talk back! http://us.click.yahoo.com/VpgUKB/pzNLAA/cUmLAA/KlSolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> ForumWebSiteAt http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Libertarian Yahoo! 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