Linux-Hardware Digest #254, Volume #14 Fri, 26 Jan 01 11:13:06 EST
Contents:
Re: Cheap PCI Hardware Modem (Trevor Smithson)
Re: To all linux user...... ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: What is the kernel module for realtek 8139??? (Steve Gage)
Re: Corel Linux Sucks :( (Mike Edwards)
Re: Corel Linux Sucks :( ("Tina Carter")
Re: Tina will beat that stupid german (Thomas Lang,urz,531 1823)
Re: Attitude - was HOW DO I INSTALLED WVDIAL??????? ("Tina Carter")
Re: How I Got My ATAPI Tape Drive To Work ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Three-button PS/2 mouse???????? ("Peter T. Breuer")
MPEG2 encoder card (Eric)
Re: Tina will beat that stupid german ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
No sound from SB Live x-gamer (David Filion)
Re: To all linux user...... ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Re: Tina will beat that stupid german ("Tina Carter")
Re: Tina will beat that stupid german ("Tina Carter")
matrox mystique MGA G200 AGP (Assihm)
Re: HOW DO I INSTALLED WVDIAL??????? (Mark Bratcher)
Re: To Linux Nazi (Mark Bratcher)
Re: Corel Linux Sucks :( (Kenneth R�rvik)
Re: es1370 - where is the sequencer/midi driver ? (James Johnson)
Re: Diagnosing hard crashes (Toby Haynes)
Re: To Linux Nazi (Kenneth R�rvik)
Re: Tina will beat that stupid german (Kenneth R�rvik)
Re: 3rd Day Same Modem and Same story...... ("Fluri Dave")
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Trevor Smithson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.networking
Subject: Re: Cheap PCI Hardware Modem
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 05:41:45 -0600
Yes, ISA is as well. Modems don't come close to using the available
bandwidth available with either bus.
On 25 Jan 2001 00:27:11 GMT, Bernd Eckenfels <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>In comp.os.linux.networking Josh Stern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> Anyway, bottom line is that there is at least one
>> cheap, competent, PCI hardware modem out there.
>
>Is the PCI Bus fast enough for modern Modems?
>
>Greetings
>Bernd
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: To all linux user......
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 12:14:44 GMT
In article <Yu4c6.2027$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
"Tina Carter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I don't why and how I only end up fighting with linux people. Never in my
> life I DID this.
>
Perhaps not, but if you pursue learning Linux
with the alacrity you have developed for fighting
with some list people, simply trying to help you,
I expect you will become an expert rather quickly.<G>
Good luck,
Pres
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
------------------------------
From: Steve Gage <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: What is the kernel module for realtek 8139???
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 12:39:26 GMT
Juergen Pfann wrote:
>
> Trygve Selmer wrote:
> >
> > "Morten F. Klausen" wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi!
> > >
> > > What is the kernel module for realtek 8139???
> > >
> > > Best regards
> > >
> > > Morten F. Klausen
> >
> > Have you tried rtl8139.o ?
> >
> > Trygve.
>
> As for 2.4(.test) kernels, you can choose the
> "rtl8139too" driver, alternatively.
Slight correction - it's 8139too for the 2.4 kernel (no "rtl").
- Steve
> With SuSE 7.0, I don't notice any difference
> to my other distros with the "old" driver, neither
> in terms of stability nor performance, though.
>
> Juergen
------------------------------
From: Mike Edwards <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Corel Linux Sucks :(
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 12:58:47 GMT
But Tina, your problem with Linux apparently goes deeper than whether
you can get your modem to work. You apparently need a basic
understanding of Unix filesystems, as well as knowing the tools you need
to solve problems in Linux. Until you learn those things, I think there
are many here that will consider you a Linux-bashing troll.
Good luck,
Mike
Tina Carter wrote:
>
> yes and they say it's winmodem which is why it sucks
>
> "Mike Edwards" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > Tina Carter wrote:
> > > I am going to buy external modem make my lif easy and if that doesn't
> work,
> > > I can always bother everyone here.
> >
> > Why waste our time and bandwidth? Have you taken anyone's advice and
> > purchased at least one Linux book and contacted a local (or Finnish)
> > Linux user group?
> >
> > --
> > Mike Edwards
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--
Mike Edwards
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: "Tina Carter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Corel Linux Sucks :(
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:13:12 -0500
If you can make my "modem and sound" workable in Linux. I won't be bashing
you :).
There is nothing more about it. It's the ONLY problem I have....
"Mike Edwards" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> But Tina, your problem with Linux apparently goes deeper than whether
> you can get your modem to work. You apparently need a basic
> understanding of Unix filesystems, as well as knowing the tools you need
> to solve problems in Linux. Until you learn those things, I think there
> are many here that will consider you a Linux-bashing troll.
>
> Good luck,
> Mike
>
>
> Tina Carter wrote:
> >
> > yes and they say it's winmodem which is why it sucks
> >
> > "Mike Edwards" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message
> > news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > Tina Carter wrote:
> > > > I am going to buy external modem make my lif easy and if that
doesn't
> > work,
> > > > I can always bother everyone here.
> > >
> > > Why waste our time and bandwidth? Have you taken anyone's advice and
> > > purchased at least one Linux book and contacted a local (or Finnish)
> > > Linux user group?
> > >
> > > --
> > > Mike Edwards
> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> --
> Mike Edwards
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: Thomas Lang,urz,531 1823 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Tina will beat that stupid german
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 14:13:01 +0100
Tina Carter wrote:
> Some German said somewhere He'll beat the hell out of me, IF HE SEES ME,
> Well stupid German, you lost the war and were killed by masses and still
> didn't learn your lesson. Here is me and let's see if you have guts to
> come here and do it or I WILL BEAT THE HELL OUT OF YOU.
>
good luck during beating us :-)
greatings from east germany
++ E-Mail : [EMAIL PROTECTED] +++++++++++++++++++++++++++
++ Band : http://www.schlagsaite.de/ +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
------------------------------
From: "Tina Carter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Attitude - was HOW DO I INSTALLED WVDIAL???????
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 08:14:28 -0500
No Thanks But I'll keep using Linux.
"Shane Baker" <sbakerATpcug.org.au> wrote in message
news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> On Thu, 25 Jan 2001 20:25:40 -0500, Tina Carter wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> >> OK, I just read s2ome of your previous posts and I see you are a 16
year
> >> old Finnish girl living in Canada. I think you need to do some more
> >> reading--especially the documentation that came with your computer.
> >> Also, since Linus Torvalds homself is a Finn, I'm sure there are some
> >> Finnish-Linux sites out there where you might be able to more easily
> >2> communicate. Here's a couple:
> >
> >I end fighting with them too :( They hate me....... Linxu nazi u know :(
>
> Given that you tell practically everyone you communicate with that they're
> nazis or communists or rapists or or racists or whatever, I'm hardly
> surprised you get no cooperation.
>
> I agree that SOME Linux people can be intellectually snobbish - but that's
> light-years away from your constant accusations!
>
> I suggest you forget about Linux.
>
> Shane Baker
> Canberra - Australia's national capital
> _____________________________
> sbakerATpcug.org.au - please correct the obvious from my email address if
replying direct
> Australian Pets newsgroup - aus.pets <<>> Australian Dogs Page -
http://www.pcug.org.au/~sbaker/dogs.htm
>
>
>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: How I Got My ATAPI Tape Drive To Work
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:20:13 +0000
On Fri, 26 Jan 2001 03:21:45 GMT, Pete Ritter
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>Lots of people (myself included) have had problems configuring their
>ATAPI tape drives to work on GNU/Linux systems. I finally got mine
>working and hoping to spare others' nerves, I'll reveal how.
>
>I configured it to use SCSI emulation. I also compiled relevant support
>into the kernel rather than as modules. Here are the configure
>parameters (I use make xconfig):
>
> Under "Block devices"
>
> "n" to "Include IDE/ATAPI TAPE support
> "n" to "Include IDE/ATAPI CDROM support"
> "y" to "SCSI emulation support"
>
> Under "SCSI support"
>
> "y" to "SCSI tape support"
> "y" to "SCSI CD-ROM support"
> "y" to "SCSI generic support"
>
>"y" means to compile the support in question into the kernel rather than
>to load it as a module. I left everything else as-is. I tried modules
>for these items but got unresolved references when one or two were
>loaded. If you don't know how to relink and install the kernel, read:
>
> /usr/src/linux/README
>
>I also added to lilo.conf append commands:
>
> hdc=ide-scsi hdd=ide-scsi
>
>where hdc and hdd are my tape drive and cdrom drive.
>
>The tape drive are /dev/st0 and the cdrom /dev/scd0, so I made these
>links:
>
> ln -s /dev/st0 /dev/tape
> ln -s /dev/scd0 /dev/cdrom
>
>since mt(1) can use the TAPE environment variable, I set it:
>
> export TAPE=/dev/st0
>
>On some installations, mt(1) uses a default of /dev/tape I believe, so
>you might not need to set TAPE.
>
>That's it! Everything works. I have:
>
>Distro: Mandrake 7.2
>kernel: 2.2.17-21mdk
>MB: PCChips M805LR
>CPU: 1 GHz K7
>RAM: 256 MB
>Tape: HP Colorado 8 GB ATAPI
>CD-ROM: cheap 56X ATAPI
>
>Good luck!
>
Many thanks,Pete. I have been trying to get mine to work for a short
time now, & this is a big help!
--
Regards, Geoff
------------------------------
From: "Peter T. Breuer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Three-button PS/2 mouse????????
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:35:51 GMT
Alan Robert Clark <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Any advice? I guess MicroSquish only uses 2-buttons, so the market for
> 3-buttons isn't there???
Logitech mice all have three buttons (and more). When I looked in a
shoplast week, the shelves were full of n-button mice. Try again.
Perhaps you don't realize that a wheel counts as a button.
Peter
------------------------------
From: Eric <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: MPEG2 encoder card
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 14:54:33 +0100
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Does anyone have any expierience with an MPEG2 encoder card with linux?
Any info positive or negative is welcome.
Eric
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Tina will beat that stupid german
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 13:50:20 GMT
Tina Carter wrote:
> Some German said somewhere He'll beat the hell out of me, IF HE SEES
ME,
> Well stupid German, you lost the war and were killed by masses and
still
> didn't learn your lesson. Here is me and let's see if you have guts to
> come here and do it or I WILL BEAT THE HELL OUT OF YOU.
>
Oh, get a life please. If you will keep flooding this (and other)
newsgroup(s) with irrelevant and insulting posts, I guess I'll be not
the only one wishing to report this to the abuse address, specified in
the header of each of your posts ([EMAIL PROTECTED]).
J.
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
------------------------------
From: David Filion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: No sound from SB Live x-gamer
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:10:39 -0500
My new system has a SB Live (x-gamer) sound card card and I can't here
anything. The driver
loads OK (emu10k1), lspci lists it.
Under kde and gnome I can here mp3s if I crank up the volumn and press
my ear
to the speaker. I can't here anything at all from my CD (it is seen as
sr0).
The CD player read it ok (it gets the info CDDB etc.).
What can I do to remedy this?
At boot up the driver lists the IO at 0xe000 - 0xe01f where as lspci
lists it at 0xe400.
Could the difference in IO addresses be causing the problem? Is the
model correct (see below)?
Stats:
Sound: Creative SB Live x-gamer 5.1.
Kernel 2.4.0 SMP
Abit VP6 motherboard
Dual Intel P3 866
512M SDRAM
Driver: emu10k1 compiled into kernel
IO: 0xe000-0xe0ff, IRQ 18
bus 0, device 13
Driver bootup message for driver:
Creative EMU10K1 PCI Audio Driver version 0.7
emu10k1: EMU10K1 rev 7 model 0x8061 found at 0xe000-0xe01f, IRQ 18
lspci:
00:0d.0 Multimedia audio controller: creative sb live ... (etc)
Thanks.
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: To all linux user......
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 14:22:34 GMT
In article <A5ac6.2157$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
"Tina Carter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> <Snap off>I can beat the hell out of you
>
> Funny who beated who durning world war 2? Didn't you german learn
anything?
>
>
This flamewar is just pure BULLSHIT!!! If you can't post anything
informative or an innocent question, then don't post. End this
pointless war!!!! Else, just get the hell out. I am sick of it. Now,
if you ask nicely, maybe someone would help you. BUt, NO, you have to
start out by saying that clamping M$ is like racism. That was just
plain stupid. It makes me think that you are just in here to stir up
trouble. And, you know what? YOu did. Look at how many people you
have pissed off. End this NOW!!!!!
Justin Hibbits
Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
------------------------------
From: "Tina Carter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Tina will beat that stupid german
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:53:08 -0500
read the rules idiots. THIS IS NOT ABUSE BUT YOU JUST HARAZED ME.
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:94rvap$la1$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Tina Carter wrote:
>
> > Some German said somewhere He'll beat the hell out of me, IF HE SEES
> ME,
> > Well stupid German, you lost the war and were killed by masses and
> still
> > didn't learn your lesson. Here is me and let's see if you have guts to
> > come here and do it or I WILL BEAT THE HELL OUT OF YOU.
> >
>
> Oh, get a life please. If you will keep flooding this (and other)
> newsgroup(s) with irrelevant and insulting posts, I guess I'll be not
> the only one wishing to report this to the abuse address, specified in
> the header of each of your posts ([EMAIL PROTECTED]).
>
> J.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/
------------------------------
From: "Tina Carter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Tina will beat that stupid german
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 09:53:59 -0500
And stop being racist and extreemist and NAZI.
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote in message news:94rvap$la1$[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> Tina Carter wrote:
>
> > Some German said somewhere He'll beat the hell out of me, IF HE SEES
> ME,
> > Well stupid German, you lost the war and were killed by masses and
> still
> > didn't learn your lesson. Here is me and let's see if you have guts to
> > come here and do it or I WILL BEAT THE HELL OUT OF YOU.
> >
>
> Oh, get a life please. If you will keep flooding this (and other)
> newsgroup(s) with irrelevant and insulting posts, I guess I'll be not
> the only one wishing to report this to the abuse address, specified in
> the header of each of your posts ([EMAIL PROTECTED]).
>
> J.
>
>
> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/
------------------------------
From: Assihm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: matrox mystique MGA G200 AGP
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:05:25 GMT
hello :)
configuring the X window system on Deb2.2 box im not able to see the
right reference in the card database so i cannot make X running. Using
lspci i find that the video card is a Matrox Mystique MGA G200 AGP,
openeing the box i cannot read whats on the video chip because its
covered. is there some particular thing to do to make my X window system
working properly with a AGP video card?
thnx-a-lot
Assihm :)
------------------------------
From: Mark Bratcher <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: HOW DO I INSTALLED WVDIAL???????
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:26:29 -0500
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> > - Exactly what make and model number is your modem? (You may need to
> > open your computer and read the card--or see what Windows tells you.)
> Lucent Vinus Modem 56k. Internal.
>
> > - Just because your modem works with Windows ME, does not mean it will
> > work with Linux. Some modems rely heavily on software to run properly.
> I know and I decided to give up on this internal modem, I think it's Win
> modem. Note there is no doc about modem when I bought it :( But I am goin to
> buy 56k external modem. Which one is good and with in 130$?
Have you tried www.linmodems.org?
> I end fighting with them too :( They hate me....... Linxu nazi u know :(
Er.... I would think Micro$oft and Windows are closer to Nazism than Linux is.
But I don't wish to belabor this useless thread any further.
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==============303F9D51783B35D37423E082==
------------------------------
From: Mark Bratcher <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: To Linux Nazi
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:41:41 -0500
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Tina Carter wrote:
>
> > If you expect help here you might want to can the attitude. That post was
> > totally uncalled for.
>
> You are wrong, my attitude help this group to evolve into new era where my
> style love and humanity is dominated and respected.
Yes, that's what this newsgroup needs. More love and humanity in the form of
contention and slander so that we can solve a simple problem in 50 or more mail
threads instead of just 3 or 4 maybe. This is progress!
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==============B9FF493DD9C0FBCA1AEE9D5B==
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Corel Linux Sucks :(
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kenneth R�rvik)
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:48:45 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tina Carter) wrote in
<Cs4c6.2023$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>I won't lie to you it's corel linxu sucks....... Beside having idiot
>modem, and onboard sound card :(
>IT JUST SUCks :(.....
I tend to agree - Mandrake is much better, as is RedHat. Recommend Mandrake
for hardware support and ease of use.
>I am going to buy external modem make my lif easy and if that doesn't
>work, I can always bother everyone here.
It'll work - as long as you read the HOWTO in advance :) www.linuxdoc.org,
look for the PPP-howto. Other than that, kppp is a nice little app for
setting ut the modem.
--
Kenneth R�rvik 91841353/22950312
Nordbergv. 60 A [EMAIL PROTECTED]
0875 OSLO home.no.net/stasis
------------------------------
From: James Johnson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: es1370 - where is the sequencer/midi driver ?
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:30:53 -0500
Is the equivalent information contained elsewhere? Say, in /proc?
David Balazic wrote:
> <snip>
> /dev/sndstat is not implemented for the newer drivers , because
> the developers decided so :-)
> <snip>
------------------------------
From: Toby Haynes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Diagnosing hard crashes
Date: 26 Jan 2001 10:42:05 -0500
On 26 Jan 2001, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> Toby Haynes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>> My Aptiva 865 running Linux appears to be creaking and crashing more and
>> more. The symptoms include
>
>> - fails to reach the Lilo prompt on boot (i.e. just a flashing cursor)
>> - spontaneous reboot (as in typing at terminal shell one second,
>> power-up screen the next)
>> - hard crashes (total lockup of sound, graphics and keyboard, no Alt-SysRq-
>> recovery possible).
>
>> The system hardware looks like this:
>
>> Athlon 650MHz
>> 200W power supply
>> Elsa Erazor III video card (basically a TNT2U)
> 200W power supply with that kind/amount of hardware ??
>
> Many people buy 350W or 400W power supplies for their Athlon.
> I figure they have a reason...
>
> In short: Athlon is known for power problems, and if you have a TNT2, then
> it's even worse.
That was what I figured. Do you know that this 200W power supply is in almost
all of the Aptiva Athlon range? I find that vaguely scary. Even more scary is
that there are no higher-powered power supplies recommended by IBM for this
machine. Still I guess I can't fry the motherboard too badly by stepping up to
300W+ or higher, and it's using an ATX connector from the mobo so if I can get
the power supply caddy off the current one I think I should be able to buy a
generic ATX power supply to replace this one.
To anyone with an Aptiva - its worth downloading the hardware reference manual
on the IBM site and finding the exploded diagram of the chassis. The Aptiva
power supply has a strange casing, but according to the the diagrams it can be
removed. Maybe thats the task for tonight...
I did some comparison shopping to see what the lowest AMD rated power supply
was and the smallest was 238W, with the most common being 300W. I previously
took two PCI cards out of the machine and stabilized it that way but I've added
new toys since then. So power brownouts look a likely candidate.
Hmm. Time to part with some money methinks.
Cheers,
Toby Haynes
--
Toby Haynes
The views and opinions expressed in this message are my own, and do
not necessarily reflect those of IBM Canada.
------------------------------
Subject: Re: To Linux Nazi
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kenneth R�rvik)
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:53:34 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tina Carter) wrote in
<HA4c6.2031$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>You are wrong, my attitude help this group to evolve into new era where
>my style love and humanity is dominated and respected.
I assume you are referring to posts like: "You suck tooooo and Suck your
peeeee" ???
Excellent style, love and quality Tina... ;)
--
Kenneth R�rvik 91841353/22950312
Nordbergv. 60 A [EMAIL PROTECTED]
0875 OSLO home.no.net/stasis
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Tina will beat that stupid german
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kenneth R�rvik)
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 15:55:40 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tina Carter) wrote in
<Adgc6.2330$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>And stop being racist and extreemist and NAZI.
*plonk*
--
Kenneth R�rvik 91841353/22950312
Nordbergv. 60 A [EMAIL PROTECTED]
0875 OSLO home.no.net/stasis
------------------------------
From: "Fluri Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: 3rd Day Same Modem and Same story......
Date: Fri, 26 Jan 2001 10:51:02 +0500
"Hello, Mac's garage. May I help you?"
"Umm, yes. My car won't go."
"I see. What seems to be the trouble with it?"
"Well, it won't go. Someone told me it might be the left-handed
widget."
"I see. Can you bring it in so we can have a look at it?"
"Well, no, 'cause it won't go. But I did go to the parts place and
I bought a left-handed widget."
"And?"
"No go."
"Did you install the widget?"
"Yes."
"And did it make any difference?"
"No, except that now, when I look under the car in the engine area, I
see a left-handed widget lying on the ground."
"How did you install it?"
"I put it under the hood, where it goes."
"I'm afraid you're going to have to bring your car in if you want us
to fix it. I can send a tow-truck around."
"No thanks, nazi pig!" *CCCLLLLIIIIICCCCCCKKKKKKK*
--
Dave Fluri
North Bay, Ontario Canada
------------------------------
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