On Sat, 4 Jun 2005, Matan Ziv-Av wrote:
No it is not. There are many examples of kernel modules that provide
support for modems, network drivers and other devices, which are NOT open
source and NOT 'aggregations'. If you don't want to make your 802.11g
wireless card work
If the modules are distributed apart from the kernel itself (as is usually
the case for the modules you speak of), then Linus allows this. Some other
I.o.w., if the modules come on disk and are loaded at run time by a
script it's ok. You know what ? That's exactly what they are doing.
Unbelievable. What is 'distributed' in an embedded context ? An
appliance is a device. It contains everything that needs to be in it to
make it work. Even the batteries sometimes. And Linus and the authors of
the libraries and of the utilities (and of busybox) know this and they
are ok with this, as far as an open source solution does not exist. The
LGPL was designed specifically to allow user applications to be linked
against it for this purpose, and most libraries used in embedded are
under LGPL.
kernel specifically do not allow this, so anyone who distributes such modules
is at risk. For modules that come together with the kernel, as is the case
with the ECI router, this is not allowed by Linus' exception, nor by anything
else.
Would you mind my hearing this from Linus ? Because he knows about these
embedded systems, and endorses them as far as I know. And the author of
Busybox is quoted on linuxdevices.com as endorsing at least one of the
products because it (the built in busybox) lets him work so well with
it.
So I can create copies of CDs I buy in the store, and "rent" them to other
people? ECI do not have a right to "rent" Linux kernel or Busybox, except if
they follow the GPL, which they do not.
Yes, you can, if and only if it's linux or open source based and the
license permits you to do that. You are allowed to charge money for it.
You can copy it and sell the copies. This is explicitly specified in the
GPL. The idea is that open competition will push the price down to the
range where the product is sustainable. Be the price bandwidth and time
for download, media, printing and distribution, added value, or all of
these things. And it works that way because that's the way it was
designed to work. In fact, that is the WHOLE POINT of it.
http://www.mvista.com/previewkit/ This is a commercial firm that provides
advanced linux development packages.
Monta Vista provides source with every binary of a GPL program that they
provide. What has that got to do with ECI?
Hello ?! We are talking about an ECI router box that runs a Monta Vista
Linux kernel and busybox, yes ? Don't lose focus on the original topic,
I will not follow you in philosophical pursuits.
What I can or can not find on the internet is irrelevant to the fact that ECI
have to do specific things if they want to distributes Linux or Busybox, and
the other fact, that they do not do those things.
This is ridiculous. What do you expect them to do, email you a cdrom ?
What do you mean what has this got to do with the ECI router ?!! Where
do you think I got the information about Monta Vista on that box ?!! I
ssh'd into it and typed cat /proc/version !!!
You have no idea what you are talking about, you are interpreting things
in ways that defy objective reality, and I think that threads like this
can cause people who later find them in the archives to draw wrong
conclusions as to the suitability of Linux for embedded appliances. Your
kind of postings on this thread so far has been a disservice to Linux
and to the spirit of the GPL in my opinion.
Peter
PS: One more thread like this and I will unsubscribe again, as I did
years ago. I am a member of about 5 mailing lists in 3 countries and
there is only one that has flamefests over cold water. Guess which. I
have been using Linux as a desktop for 9 years now, talked to a lot of
people over the internet, but there is only one place where such
discussions are possible. Enough is enough.
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