From: "Sudhakar Chandra" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> All through history, tons of hogwash has been justified at the time of
> its happening in the name of national security. A healthy dose of
> scepticism about all secrecy, especially in government, is most
> important.
--*snipped*--
Let us stick to discussing computer/linux security on this list, please. :)
There are a lot of other places for venting off against the govt. :)
> Besides, I am not against security, per se. If you are /that/ serious
> about security, use secure software and encrypt your data. I am against
> short sighted pseudo-security measures.
Such measures *are* taken now, or at least are in the stage of
implementation in various sensitive military installations.
> Such, non-fool-proof "security measures" have two problems with them:
>
> 1. They are frequently used by the jack booted thugs to make the weaker
> fear them. I.e. is it used a way of controlling the masses. And the
> masses are you and I.
>
> 2. They often lead to a false sense of security when all it is in the
> first place is, as you yourself indicated, a pretence.
As I said once, putting a lock on your door is a then also a pretence
because any on with a nice crowbar and some muscles (or a good amount of
explosives if it makes you happy, for the sake of an argument) can get in.
But it does servers its purpose of possibly having some detectable *noise*
being made.
Security software/patching etc. can't always protect against a completely
new exploit that has come out. Really... what do you do if someone finds out
yet another, completely new ssh exploit and tries it for the first time
against your server itself ? or even a remote IIS/apache/whatever based one
?
There *is* no fool-proof solution or encryption algorithm as well.
None exists. It is almost a case of Turing's problem.
The whole idea about security is that we must run the red queen's race
("Through the looking glass"). You have to run just to stay at the same
place. You can't 100% prevent being hacked in the end. But you can reduce
the possibility of its happening.
The fact that there is no fool-proof solution, leads to having do with
non-fool proof ones. If you have suggestions on a fool-proof solution, I am
sure lots of govt. think tank/computer science bigwigs who have so far
failed at finding one, will applaud your genius.
> > No one strip searched the guards afaik. What is your point ?
>
> Perhaps you have not heard of the saying "who polices the police". My
"Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?" "Who watches the watchmen?" - Juvenal,
Satires VI, 347.
Quoted also, as the epigraph of the Tower Commission Report - 1987, which
was submitted regards The Iran-Contra affair of 1986 during Reagen's term
when Lebanese newspaper Al-Shiraa reports that the United States secretly
sold arms to Iran.
Quote correctly, if you must. :)
> point was who supervises these people who are supposed to supervise us
> lowly mortals? How can an employer trust the enforcers of such
> "security" mechanisms? And what are the checks and blances?
Erm. If I am in charge of maintaining security of a company, the company has
to place an implicit trust. And watchers watch each other too, btw. That is
the main check and balance possible. :)
Case in quote : Randal Schwartz's arrest on the on complaint filed by Intel
in 1993. Please don't give arguements about whether he was at fault or not,
but it is just an example as how another administrator detected his
activities and confronted him.
> Patriotism, as Benjamin Disareli put it, is the last resort of
> scoundrels. There has been more evil perpetrated in Indian under the
> name of national security, patriotism and religion than everything else
> combined.
So what are you suggesting ? throw away the baby with the bathwater ?
:)
That is what it sounds like.
Regards,
Abhi
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