Hi!
Trying to kill the keyboard, [EMAIL PROTECTED] produced:
> > Trying to kill the keyboard, [EMAIL PROTECTED] produced:
> > > Yea, I'm a nut with IDE, 10 drives on this box, makes for good irc pissing
> > Well, talk about IRQ latency, especially if you serve a couple
> Not really... the disks are way faster than needed.
The disks, yes, but the other stuff might have troubles. But you
said you used irqtune
> > I am just thinking at times. :-) Can't stop it then. Which shrink
> > do you recommend? :-)
> Dr. Ruth? :-)
Naah. Sometimes a cigar ist just that, a cigar. Just ask Freud.
> > M/K/G is a bit more human readable, though, so just make it
> > an option.
> I was going to do that :-) for all the silly machines.
So how comes your machines can't multiply by 1024 ... or shifting
bits left and right. Mine do that stuff all the time :-) Or do
you have a machine based on the number 10? (Does that mean -0 !=
0 on it?)
> > I know there's QMAGIC and ZMAGIC but it was new to me the magic
> > changed the way ext2 works ... :->
> It can effect how it operates actually... look into /lib again :-)
> Yeah, i know it's mostly for the tools, however... the kernel can be built
> a.out, etc...
The Kernel is not swappable, so what? It does not need to load
libraries from HD, it's practically compiled --static (apart
from modules). Or am I wrong (again)?
> > Nah, you can break lilo a bit too easy for my taste, e.g. by
> > defragmenting the disk or moving the kernel. Loadlin just
> You have the source... :-)
> Stop bitching, and write it :-)
> MAke lilo store it'sself in the entire CYL0 HEAD0 area and ext2fs smart...
Well, I do have the source but the design options in LILO
just were that you have locked positions of the kernel & co.
Changing that would mean writing a new program or hacking ext2
(and other FS) support into LILO, which is kinda hard in <512
bytes. Reserving more for the 1st stage loader means it's harder
to retrofit. /boot is a better idea here. And I lack the time
to get the experience needed, I'm afraid.
And kexec ... has that ever been implemented anywhere?
> Lots of the "EZ-DRIVE" type programs to this...
And you get a boot sector virus and can but hope you have
a backup. And it's sooo easy to get one.
> Better yet, mount /boot in it's own partition, with a kernel.
> I have done this on some of my customer's boxes :-)
> you could also tell ext2defrag to not move some important files...
So I need to know all important files by name. Gaah. If I
wanted that kind of manual control as the *only* possibility,
I should also defrag by hand, using a disk editor. :_)
> > See, *you* know what e2defrag can do to your HD if you strike
> > bad luck, yet you offer it as a good and *safe* solution.
> I did? I think I offered it more as a last-ditch effort... atleast, that was
> my intent :-)
No, it arrived as a 'this is the way to save your soul. DO that
if you have problems ... and if you don't have problems, do
it anyway!'
> > I merely know people who are unable to run a mac or Windows on their own. :-/
> Prolly aol subscribers, and the like :-)
Naah. People who don't want to use computers and are not
interested. Or if they do, they just use (program X) which
autostarts. Some of them are clueful enough to know they know
nothing and don't break anything.
> > But I happen to have
> > and like some legacy games in DOS and had no time to play with
> > dosemu yet. (Especially as that *can* do harmful things to the
> > continued uptime of your Linux.)
> I've no time/manual dextarity for games. I have more important things to do,
> like make linux better :-)
Games != manual dexterity. Some are. Some aren't. And time?
Well, others drink a pub empty, watch soccer or other sports,
spend hours in front of the telly. I save time there and spend
it otherwise (like Linux & games).
> *ROFL* I won't even comment how old I am or how long I've used linux.
Let me guess, you are 18 and use Linux since ... oh, 1985. Aeh,
sorry, wrong place, we weren't discussing the jobs managers want
to offer or others want to fill. (8 years java experience ...)
> Yes, they are stored off site, and they use the tr-1 drive. Not only is it
> redundant storage, but the redundant *COPY* can be read by both drives.
> So, yes, I also have redundant drives :-)
Ah. Now guess how many percent of 1 percent of the readers here
happen to do that. :-)
> > And again you say that's a *safe* thing to do, without mentioning
> > that you need belts, braces, airbag and 3 parachutes to be safe!
> It is if you got redundancies like I have...
"Sure, jumping out of a plane is completely safe" the instructor
said. "I have done so before, and it's actually fun." A few
hours later the ground was littered with many bodys in small
craters. The police said the instructor told them "Well, of
COURSE I have a parachute and use it. I can't help these people,
for sure they must have known what they did."
A lawyer speaking for the family of one of the victims claims
his client had never heard of parachutes before. "The Instructor
should have pointed out that using a parachute and a backup chute
is the minimum requirement for these activities. He did not,
however, point out that fact. Indeed he only mentioned it under
questioning from experienced police officers who knew a bit about
parachuting themselves. It's just like advising people to buy
high risk shares without first checking them out. So we are going
to sue him for misleading information and computerslaughter."
> > Yes, you *can* do that. No, it's not a preferred method for
> > normal operation. In fact, this is only useful for me winning
> > my argument and a few funny special circumstances.
> AHAHAHHA.
Ticklish? :-)
> > You need a direct neural connection to your 'puters, it seems.
> > And a loudspeaker on the 'puter. ;-)
> I've been conducting expiraments with... nahhh, I better try to stay on topic
> here... >8-(>
Let me guess ... controling the cursor by thought. Well, people
have done that, it works. Just not very usable right now.
> > > RPM? no no... dude, I hand compile all my stuff, no dists here.
> > Now, I don't have the time to hand-compile everything in sight.
> Nore do I... the computers do that for me... all 10 of them :-)
> When you got 10, you can do it alot faster :-)
True, but either you just ./configure; make; make install
or you do it 'right' (e.g. checking where every file goes,
protecting other files, removing superflous files on upgrades)
or you throw that on a package manager (and have to spend some
time configuring there)
> I can see a benifit to that... I think... course, I don't rm much... I just
> keep adding disks :-) I ordered 3 more 10G tonite :-)
You are sure you don't want SCSI? Aren't you running out of
IRQs and slots now? Or don't you want to buy a black goat?
> > /var always changes, and can overflow. In your case, it would
> > overflow /tmp as well. Ever ran a system with *no* space in /tmp?
> Nope... I make sure it has enuff elbow room.
Sure :-) How long are you away from the machine? And if you
use find, better hope you have no evil users. :-)
> > But then, it's your system and you may damn well do with it as
> > you like. :-)
> Unlike windos... :-)
Wrong. You can damn well roll Windows out ... righ out of
the Window. I'll even hold the window open, but I ain't gonna
push and I ain't gonna shove. You can do with it what you want
(provided Billy want you to want it).
> > > Nope... I have many large multimegabyte databases here.
> Actually, most of it is sequentially read. No, I'm not explaining why or
> what it is :-)
Ok, just one question: How much faster is it read by dd?
> future... yes, I have to be vague... top secret stuff, sorry :-)
Oh. Do I have to burn it before reading? Or do you have to
kill me before telling me?
> > But that's not the problem, since your 386 worked well, you
> > said, and I guess you have more spare cycles than a whole 386
> > can offer for backup.
> If it's NOT the libs, then it MUST be something else? If so, what? :-)
Now, HERE is a question. I assume you do religiously retension
your tapes and clean the heads every couple of hours of
operation? You don't have any temperature/humidity change
problems with your tapes? Your tapes are quality tapes and
reasonably new (so it's not a (series) of bad tapes that causes
the problems)? You IRQtune the tape on a very high priority.
Your floppy controler works. The tape drives are not marginal.
Well, either I do not spot the right hints now or I happen not
to have enough information. Try waving dead chickens over the
computer & the tape drives, or sacrifice some blood (yours or
others).
> Anyone else try this? I don't think so... It never hurts to try, because
> it's already broken...
Hmmm ... You have (the space for) a backup root? Wipe it, copy
your current root to there (cp -a or tar | tar or something (but
not dd)). Then the backup root is not fragmented. Boot from it.
Test it.
> > You can't tune it on 2.0.15-18 either (experimental round-robin,
> > balanced priority system).
> I know. It sucks [place favorite body part here].
Rocks through straws? How many mLL?
> > > Ok, then explain why it works now... I'm talking not only writing, but
> > > reading too. BOTH had the problem before the defragmentation (a.k.a HD
> > > restore)
> > ... now that's strange, since even the most fragmented HD
> > should be able to give you that sort of throughput. It's not
> > the processor (I ran 2000Mbis/s on a single Pentium 150Mhz for
^
kbit/s, obviously
> > a long time with no errors of that kind). You have 4 times the
> > RAM. Yet one tape won't go at 1000 (while the other one does).
> > *thinks (yeah, I am sick)*
> Is my computer possesed?
The ghost in the machine, maybe?
> > *lightbulb*
> > Hey, if it was really fragmentation, how do we explain that one
> > of them runs OK at 1000 and the other doesn't?
> Time sensitive drive?
TR-1 should be less sensitive.
> > Do you drive them at different IRQ's on separate controlers?
> No. I yank the drive off the same cable.
Hmmm.
> > What happens if
> > you strip down the machine bit by bit until the other tape works
> > too?
> Can't... I have others using this box and feeding 10 others, remember?
> I'm limited in what I can and can't strip out... Downtime is a no-no.
Damn, you are stubbornly loyal to your users. How much do they
pay you? How many times do they thank you and make you feel
special? How often do they bring you presents and new hardware?
:-)
You could always hook the others on the 386 you used for
backup :-)
> > It could be anything (including bad connections), since
> > you opened the machine and did your stuff.
> Case opened? no no... my drive sits ontop of the system, and is not in any
> enclosure. I have an external connector to the floppy controller.
> I do this so I don't have to constantly dick around opening the case, even
> tho it's not a big deal, cause the case is a pizza box style one.
> So it's the same cables, etc, only the drive changed.
Ok, recheck THAT connector and it's partners, clean it in
isopropylalcohol, etc.
> > You may know, but does Joe Random Reader know? What's wrong
> > with spreading clues (it's how I learned a lot)?
> Nothing. Infact, I am.... and I'm causing you to think, aren't I?
Sorry to bust your bubble, but ... problems make me think if
they are clearly described (I'm not much of a mind reader). :-)
> > And how come you speak Lojban?
> It's less wordy than Klingon?
http://xiron.pc.helsinki.fi/lojban/lojbroch.html
(I think so. I don't speak Klingon, it has to many ' 's anyway.)
> Nore will I, actually... Next attempt will be IDE. :-)
Who pays you, IDE? :-)
> > Ah, that's a plan. Oh, while you are on it, how about building
> > a complete working ftape/afio ramdisk ... if it's in a ramdisk
> > it won't hinder the IDE drive, and you can control the amount
> > of fragmentation easily.
> WOO, I could do that VERY easily and quickly from my backup partition...
> just force it to load it into ram... excellent idea!
Yep, you want the ramdisk as rootdisk. If you want to use your
backup root (you can also construct a new one on a free
partition, disused swapspace, floppy or RAM ... that way it'll
compress better, because empty areas are really just zeros. You
may want to strip everything before/while copying if you want a
bootdisk):
Make the filesystem you want to use.
See that your Kernel runs ramdisks and initial ramdisks, floppies
(for bootdisks) and your choosen FS (minix needs less
space) without modules
dd if=/dev/FILESYSTEM(e.g. /dev/ram) bs=1k (so you see the size) | \
gzip (-9 if you want) \
> /whereever
LILO wants to be told which ram-image to use, so you need a FS
on the boot medium ... there's a good description in the LILO
docs IIRC.
Oh, and read up on the /linuxrc mechanism.
> > Interesting ... you swapout AFTER ftape is loaded and you replace
> > 'buffer' by more kernel memory buffers.
> Because I've never had a problem allocating 3 buffer minimum...
I don't have (usually) unless I have a long uptime. You need to
swapout more than 7/8 of the RAM completely(!) to guarantee the
continous buffers will be found in a worst case scenario. Yet
another reason against floppy tapes and 80x86.
> > But I don't understand
> > why you swapoff-swapon ... you just shorten the amount of RAM
> > you have aviable.
> Habit, I guess :-) I don't like touching swap, unless it's absolutly
> needed... I rather have it chew into the cached disk buffers.
> Swap can affect total performance on IDE drives. I like to make damn sure
> I'm not into swap when banging on the tape deck as to ensure that the tape
> deck gets as much attention as possible from the cpu and os.
OTOH you shorten ram and can thus force the buffers to be
flushed. Since only crap that is not used for a LONG time (esp.
in your case) lands in swap, just leave it that way. Using
buffer will cache almost any problems that can happen with swap
hits. At 1000 kbit/s (did I write Mbit earlier? *bonk self*)
you get 125 Kb/s. With your 16 DMA buffers you have 16*32Kb =
512 Kb buffer (4 seconds). With a 10 MB buffer (no prob for
you) you have 'just' 81.9+4 secs reserve. I doubt that swap can
take that long.
> > > Anything else you need to see ( except my passwords HAHAHAH )? Let me know :-)
> > Your SSN? :-)
> *ROFL*
> Atleast you have humor... nice to see that these days of serious butt
> nuggets, of whom I dispise... :-)
Humor? Damn, I was trying to mask it as sarcasm. Here goes
the planet^W^Wmy image.
But since you asked: You could wade through the output of
ftape (with the debug turned all up, perhaps) and pick out
relevant parts.
BTW, do you want to know my SSN? *looks expectingly*
-Wolfgang
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