On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 6:13 PM, Chris Penn <cantorm...@gmail.com> wrote:
> So many good threads on the list today, it is hard to choose. > > "You started the previous thread with a generic question about finding > a PHP debugger." > > I took this question to mean, "what programs do people on this list > use for php debugging?". I thought Paul was looking for a list of > programs, maybe like an 'apt-cache search socallinux:php-debugger' > kind of list. I did not think Paul was asking for an unabridged list > of every php-debugger on the internet, maybe just the ones the list > members use. Let him figure out why they are cool. > > "As a side note on something I noticed in another email. You might be > newer to Linux than some on the list you don't need to refer to > yourself as a newbie." > > Humility is a good thing. > Yes, but I don't want him to be down on himself or feel his opinions are less valuable because he is new. Everyone contributes in some way regardless if they miss a detail because they simply didn't know. > > "To be honest, there is nothing that has discouraged me from wanting > to use Linux more than this user group." > > Socallinux is awesome. Sometimes Passion gets confused for anger and > humor for insults. All in all, the list is awesome. I hope I have not > discourage anyone on the list from using Linux; the same cannot be > said about Window$. > > "It is my personal opinion that Mark Shuttleworth, and not a few > others, have discarded the antiquated philosophy of RTM/LMGTFY, and > that is the secret of their success." > > Many people conjecture about why Canonical/Ubuntu is so popular. I > believe their popularity is due to: > - The community is friendly. The ubuntuforums are very nice to noobs > and their stupid questions. The forum users also get angry with (and > sometimes take action against) nasty responses. > - Ubuntu is based on the wonderfully stable Debian and APT/Synaptic > are both easy to use and awesome. > - The distro maintainers try to keep the most cutting edge versions of > applications/drivers in the repositories which is ideal for a desktop > user. > - They have focused on getting Laptop/Desktop hardware to just work. > > "I agree--this place is not always the kindest, nor the easiest." > > Totally disagree, nothing but Socallinux <3... > > "Second, I think most GNU/Linux advocates/volunteers/users have > adopted the general ideals you suggest for us (avoiding RTFM, being > nice, etc.)..." > > On forums or on this list, RTFM is rarely used IMO, as it should be. > On an active project developers list/forum, where people are trying to > get real work done, there are still a few questions that reek of > laziness and a general lack of trying. Occasionally LMGTFY+RTMFM will > not even do the worst questions justice. > i.e.) " I am a Window$ admin (for 10yrs) and I just started using > Linux. In my expert opinion, Linux is way worse than Vista. Can > anyone tell me how to change my background?" - a linux forum. > > "Linux is a business and it is my opinion that Linux should evolve > with the trends of the day." > > Linux=/=Business. Canonical, Novell, Redhat and Hot Topic (TM) are > Businesses. I suspect some OSX an Window$ users will not understand > this but Linux is an Open Source software project that the business > world has an interested in; they are not one in the same. I do not > believe that Ubuntu or Linux should move in the direction of Window$. > Linspire, Novell, Mandriva and others have tried 'WinLinux' Distros > and none of them have turned out well IMO. Maybe Canonical will > succeed with their OSX direction but I'm still using Gnome and they > are not their yet. Linux evolves, as a project, faster than Window$ > and OSX combined. I direct you to Greg Hartman on the Linux Kernel: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2SED6sewRw > > <3 Socallinux, > > Chris... > > On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 6:32 PM, Paul Saenz <forensicneoph...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > On Tue, Jun 28, 2011 at 8:01 AM, Mark Holmquist <marktrac...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > >> First, Linux is not a business. It is a community project, and it > *works* that way. Canonical, >RH, Novell, and the like are businesses, but > this mailing list is a bunch of loosely-organized >volunteers. > > > > Did I say that SocalLinux was a business? If I said that , then that > > was a misstatement. I thought that what I said was that LInux was a > > business, and I think it's safe to stand by that statement. Whether > > you look at it from the standpoint of kernel development, the > > individual distros or GNU or even the user, Linux is conducted as a > > serious business. > > > > Even though it is presented as a community centered project, if I'm > > not mistaken, because I could be wrong, but I had the impression that > > there are many, if not the majority of significant development > > contributors who get paid at least a reasonable if not competitive > > tech salary, or contract. Nevertheless, regardless of that they, for > > the most part, have a chain of command, goals, and business procedures > > to say the least. They treat their business like a job, because they > > want to make sure that their salary, or at least their clientèle > > continues through to the next year and the year after that. > > > > I don't think I would be putting my head out on the chopping block if > > I were to say that there is a strong possibility that the majority of > > Linux users use Linux primarily for business. Regardless of having a > > large number of people who would probably fit in the category of > > hobbyist, it is still a business. Radio Control cars is a business > > even though basically all RC car drivers are hobbyists. > > > > There are members in this group who qualify, if they do not at least > > have a remote potential to contribute to those goals and prerogatives. > > I think Ragi and others are bringing out some really good viewpoints > > on the discussion of some Linux goals and direction. I know that Linux > > is a big community, and it's kind of like far away in a distant land, > > but they are having a discussion that at least parts of it would > > probably be worthy of at least a once over by the Linux Execs. > > _______________________________________________ > > LinuxUsers mailing list > > LinuxUsers@socallinux.org > > http://socallinux.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linuxusers > > > > > > -- > "As we open our newspapers or watch our television screens, we seem to > be continually assaulted by the fruits of Mankind's stupidity." > -Roger Penrose > _______________________________________________ > LinuxUsers mailing list > LinuxUsers@socallinux.org > http://socallinux.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/linuxusers >
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