Created a request, not sure if it's public: https://issues.apache.org/jira/servicedesk/customer/portal/1/INFRA-13651
On 12 March 2017 at 17:11, Ralph Goers <ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> wrote: > Yes, > > If you could send the request to infra I would appreciate it. > > Ralph > > On Mar 12, 2017, at 1:13 PM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote: > > The vote has been open for 5 days now. Based on the tallies and > discussions, it sounds like we'd like to merge the dev lists but keep the > user lists as is. Shall we move forward with combining them now? > > On 10 March 2017 at 12:27, Dominik Psenner <dpsen...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Total agreement. >> >> On 10 Mar 2017 6:26 p.m., "Ralph Goers" <ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> >> wrote: >> >>> This is exactly why we need one dev list. These last two responses >>> dropped the other lists. This is a horrible way to have discussions that >>> affect all the sub projects. >>> >>> Ralph >>> >>> >>> On Mar 10, 2017, at 9:11 AM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>> I'd love to see more unified configurations in all the subprojects. Gary >>> mentioned that as an idea for log4cxx as that would make it useful for his >>> use case where they're using both Java and C++ in various projects. >>> >>> While the programming languages in use here (Java, .NET, PHP, and C++) >>> aren't really compatible with each other, having similar architectures and >>> plugin systems could help a bit in this regard. Having more inclusive >>> conversations about this would be great. >>> >>> On 10 March 2017 at 04:29, Mikael Ståldal <mikael.stal...@magine.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I think that a vast majority of our users only uses one of the >>>> languages we support, and therefore only are interested in one of the >>>> subprojects. >>>> >>>> On Fri, Mar 10, 2017 at 11:23 AM, Dominik Psenner <dpsen...@gmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> We had once the discussion that we wanted all Apache Logging projects >>>>> to become very similar in their usage, starting with the same or a very >>>>> similar configuration. Given that we should aim towards one Apache Logging >>>>> specification and several Apache Logging specification implementations in >>>>> the form of Apache Logging subprojects. That means all the devs for all >>>>> subprojects have to talk more. To me this is a good reasons to merge the >>>>> dev mailing lists. Further I don't see why the same use case should not >>>>> apply to the user mailing lists, too. Those mailing lists see very low >>>>> traffic but all of them need a larger audience. Just quoting the last few >>>>> messages of two user mailing lists I follow: >>>>> >>>>> log4j-user: the last topic came in a week ago, the topic before that >>>>> about two weeks ago >>>>> log4net-user: the last topic came in 24 hours ago and the topic before >>>>> that a month ago >>>>> >>>>> Cheers >>>>> On 2017-03-09 19:24, Ralph Goers wrote: >>>>> >>>>> We use general as mainly an announcement list for topics that might be >>>>> of general interest to all logging projects. Generally, these are just >>>>> release announcements. >>>>> >>>>> Ralph >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 9, 2017, at 10:37 AM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Yeah, I agree that the user lists can remain separate as it doesn't >>>>> cause any issues currently. The main idea here is whether we should merge >>>>> the dev lists into one, or if we need a common dev list for all devs to >>>>> subscribe to (general@ doesn't sound appropriate, but I don't know >>>>> what that list is for). >>>>> >>>>> On 9 March 2017 at 10:26, Ralph Goers <ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> You should note that while we consider all votes only PMC votes are >>>>>> “binding”. I don’t think that changes much however. >>>>>> >>>>>> From a PMC perspective I have to say that keeping the user’s lists >>>>>> separate isn’t likely to be an issue as most of the things that would >>>>>> need >>>>>> to be discussed would be on a dev list anyway. >>>>>> >>>>>> Ralph >>>>>> >>>>>> On Mar 9, 2017, at 2:45 AM, Dominik Psenner <dpsen...@gmail.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> The votes are way too scattered over the different mailing lists so >>>>>> that I didn't even find my own vote. ;-) Therefore I'm trying to >>>>>> summarize >>>>>> the current state of the vote: >>>>>> >>>>>> log4j-dev@, log4php-dev@, log4net-dev@, log4cxx-dev@ -> >>>>>> d...@logging.apache.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Matt Sicker: +1 >>>>>> Ralph Goers: +1 >>>>>> Stefan Bodewig: +1 >>>>>> Sven Rautenverg: -1 >>>>>> Thorsten Schöning: -0 >>>>>> Ivan Habunek: -0 >>>>>> Dominik Psenner: +1 >>>>>> Remko Popma: +1 >>>>>> Mikael Ståldal: +0 >>>>>> >>>>>> Totals so far: >>>>>> +1: 5 >>>>>> +0: 1 >>>>>> -0: 2 >>>>>> -1: 1 >>>>>> >>>>>> log4j-user@, log4php-user@, log4net-user@, log4cxx-user@, general@ -> >>>>>> u...@logging.apache.org >>>>>> >>>>>> Matt Sicker: -1 >>>>>> Ralph Goers: +1 >>>>>> Stefan Bodewig: -1 >>>>>> Sven Rautenverg: -1 >>>>>> Thorsten Schöning: -0 >>>>>> Ivan Habunek: -0 >>>>>> Dominik Psenner: +1 >>>>>> Remko Popma: +1 >>>>>> Mikael Ståldal: -1 >>>>>> >>>>>> Totals so far: >>>>>> +1: 3 >>>>>> +0: 0 >>>>>> -0: 2 >>>>>> -1: 4 >>>>>> >>>>>> Sorry to anyone who's vote is missing. >>>>>> >>>>>> On 2017-03-08 05:20, Matt Sicker wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I may be missing some mailing lists considering I just subscribed to >>>>>> half of them less than five minutes ago. >>>>>> >>>>>> This is a vote to merge the various Apache Logging Services mailing >>>>>> lists. The proposal is to combine them as follows: >>>>>> >>>>>> log4j-dev@, log4php-dev@, log4net-dev@, log4cxx-dev@ -> >>>>>> d...@logging.apache.org >>>>>> log4j-user@, log4php-user@, log4net-user@, log4cxx-user@, general@ -> >>>>>> u...@logging.apache.org >>>>>> >>>>>> commits@ and private@ remain the same as before. >>>>>> >>>>>> The proposal would also suggest that the old emails become aliases >>>>>> for the combined email names so as not to lose any future emails. To >>>>>> distinguish between projects, a subject tag can be added such as: >>>>>> >>>>>> [java] >>>>>> [net] >>>>>> [cxx] >>>>>> [php] >>>>>> >>>>>> Though I wouldn't think such a tag is required, though it should help >>>>>> in gaining the attention of the appropriate audience. >>>>>> >>>>>> Voting: >>>>>> >>>>>> +1: Yes, combine the mailing lists! >>>>>> +0: Go ahead, don't care that much. >>>>>> -0: Don't like it, but not vetoing it. >>>>>> -1: No, don't do that! I have a better idea! >>>>>> >>>>>> This vote follows the same "lazy consensus" (at least 3 +1 binding, >>>>>> no -1/vetoes) we use for general releases and whatnot. The vote will be >>>>>> open for at least 72 hours. >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>> >>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>> Senior software developer >>>> >>>> *Magine TV* >>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com >>>> <http://www.magine.com/> >>>> >>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in this >>>> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message >>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), you may >>>> not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, >>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply >>>> email. >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> >>> >>> >>> > > > -- > Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> > > > -- Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
