Anthony, I must confess I should be entirely surprised, withdraw anything I said before and claim the opposite, if any of the several MT temperaments worked with the baroque lute in D minor tuning. The simple reason is that naturals lie on the same frets as sharps and flats, respectively. I put up two charts so as to show the problem, the first for sharps, assuming keys around A major (ton de la chevre); the second for the flat, assuming keys like C or F minor (that way justifying D flat).
1. Sharps (3rd, 5th, 6th, 9th frets don't work) 0 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | | | | | | | | | | | | f' | f#' | g | g#' | a' | a#' | b' | c'' | c#'' | d'' | d#'' | d' | d#' | e | e#' | f#' | g' | g#' | a' | a#' | b' | c'' | a | a# | b | c' | c#' | d' | d#' | e' | e#' | f#' | g' | f | f# | g | g# | a | a# | b | c' | c#' | d' | d#' | d | d# | e | e# | f# | g | g# | a | a# | b | c' | A | A# | B | c | c# | d | d# | e | e# | f# | g | 2. Flats (1st, 3rd, 5th, 6th, 8th frets don't work) 0 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | 7 | 8 | 9 | 10 | | | | | | | | | | | | f' | f#' | g | ab' | a' | bb' | b' | c'' | db'' | d'' | eb'' | d' | eb' | e | f' | f#' | g' | ab' | a' | bb' | b' | c'' | a | bb | b | c' | db' | d' | eb' | e' | f' | f#' | g' | f | f# | g | ab | a | bb | b | c' | db' | d' | eb' | d | eb | e | f | f# | g | ab | a | bb | b | c' | A | Bb | B | c | db | d | eb | e | f | f# | g | Mathias "Anthony Hind" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> schrieb: > Dear Timo and Rob > I don't have that much experience with the sound of gut strung 11c > lutes, but this one seems very sweet in the top and mid, no hint of > woodyness, which you some times have with a new lute in that area. > I have only just tuned it up, and probably not in the ideal 6th > comma, but it does seem good. > > These are my very first impressions; It is gorgeous in the hands form > a playing point of view, as light as feather, it feels. > Regards > Anthony > > > > > > Le 17 juin 08 à 12:32, Peedu Timo a écrit : > > > Dear Anthony, > > > > Congrats of your new lute. Will we see photos of it soon? > > > > Timo > > > > -----Alkuperäinen viesti----- > > Lähettäjä: Anthony Hind [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Lähetetty: 17. kesäkuuta 2008 12:50 > > Vastaanottaja: [email protected] Net > > Aihe: [LUTE] New Baroque lute/Meantone > > > > Dear lutists > > Another very basic question about Meantone tuning. As we have taken > > on board the idea that the 'old ones' first tuned the top string to > > breaking point and then tuned up the other strings in relation to > > that (I know this is probably not necessarily true, in particular for > > Baroque lute). > > However, taking that idea on board, if we consider that the top > > string on a modern G lute is generally strung so as to be played at G > > (LA 440Hz) and that the top string is chosen to be near breaking > > point at G, do we have to be careful about adding the small per cents > > that we sometimes have to add for particular 6th comma tunings. > > I imagine these differences are so small (e.g. 3;3% in D. v. O's > > table) that this could only matter if we took the notion of "up to > > breaking point" too literally. > > > > Now, I have just received my new 11c lute, and it is quite splendid, > > but I was told by Stephen Gottlieb by mail that it had been set up > > with the frets in 6th comma. I just want to tune it up to try it, and > > I am not worried about acheiving the right 6th comma for the > > particular tonality of any specific piece. In which 6th comma variant > > would a Baroque lute most likely to have been tuned? The strings are > > new (only three days on the instrument, so they have obviously gone > > quite far out of tune and don't give any indication, except the > > possible 410Hz diapason. > > > > I would like to set my Turbo tuner with one of these, at least to > > have a rapid but safe tune up. (I have a feeling the lute has been > > tuned to LA 410, although LA 392 might be better for a 70cm lute to > > save the top strings). > > I know, I should do this by ear, but with a new lute, and never > > having played an 11c, well .... > > So should I go for 1/6th Comma Meantone with an Equally Tempered Root > > of A, or C. I am thinking the frets have probably been set with one > > variant in mind. > > > > Petersen Chart: > > Here are the offsets for 1/6th Comma Meantone where A=440Hz: > > > > [b][i]Note_____Offset[/i][/b] > > C________+04.9 > > C#_______-06.4 > > D________+01.7 > > Eb_______+09.8 > > E________-01.6 > > F________+06.5 > > F#_______-04.9 > > G________+03.3 > > Ab_______-08.2 > > A________-00.0 > > Bb_______+08.1 > > B________-03.2 > > > > 1/6th Comma Meantone with an Equally Tempered Root of C: > > > > [i][b]Note_____Offset[/b][/i] > > C________+00.0 > > C#_______-11.3 > > D________-03.2 > > Eb_______+04.9 > > E________-06.5 > > F________+01.6 > > F#_______-09.8 > > G________-01.6 > > Ab_______-13.1 > > A________-04.9 > > Bb_______+03.2 > > B________-08.1 > > > > This from D.v.O. be better, actually it appears indicate a root of A, > > http://home.planet.nl/~d.v.ooijen/david/writings/meantone_p_bestanden/ > > silbermann.JPG > > > > I am tempted to go for the root of A, simply because both the above > > include this, but F is +06,5% (ok that can't do any harm to the top > > string, can it?) > > > > I am going to contact Stephen to check, but I am a little impatient, > > having already thoroughly photographed it. > > Regards > > Anthony > > -- > > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html > > > -- Viele Grüße Mathias Rösel http://mathiasroesel.livejournal.com http://www.myspace.com/mathiasroesel http://de.geocities.com/mathiasroesel
