Yeah! Thanks Jean-Marie. Seems to have been quite widespread. The norm
rather than an exception? But you could have found better modern
examples. Watch the Travelling Wilburys, where both Orbison, Lynne and
Harrison are at it big time!
G.
On Fri, Oct 2, 2015 at 9:54 AM, jmpoirier2 <[1][email protected]>
wrote:
Please have a look at this page I put up a couple of years ago...
[2]http://le.luth.free.fr/pouce/index.html
Best to all,
Jean-Marie
-------- Message d'origine --------
De : jelmaa <[3][email protected]>
Date : 01/10/2015 23:50 (GMT+01:00)
A : lutelist Net <[4][email protected]>
Objet : [LUTE] Re: Thumb-over
I think the terms 'common' and 'replete' are very exaggerated for
19th
century guitar repertoire. The LH thumb is used occasionally, but
almost only in Viennese/Austrian solo repertoire, not in French or
Spanish music. For it to work you need a guitar with a very thin
neck,
and it still messes up your left hand technique (in my experience,
playing on original 19th C French & Viennese guitars).
Jelma van Amersfoort
On Oct 1, 2015, at 22:43 , G. C. wrote:
> Hey Chris, that's really interesting. So the 19th century
repertoire is
> replete with this technique? I'm surprized and feel there is
much
to
> this matter, which hasn't been thoroughly analyzed yet. :)
G.
>
> On Thu, Oct 1, 2015 at 6:28 PM, Christopher Wilke
> <[1][5][email protected]> wrote:
>
> The technique was common in 19th century guitar playing,
where
it
> was
> often marked with a "^". It does have some advantages and
there
> are
> spots where it facilitates fewer chord shape changes. In
that
> repertoire, I haven't encountered any pieces that I
absolutely
> couldn't
> finger without the thumb over the neck. (I did, however,
perform
> one
> contemporary piece in which the only way I could figure
out
how
> to get
> a particular combination of notes was to use the left hand
thumb.
> This
> was not due to cleverness on the composer's part, but
rather
> because he
> wasn't a guitarist at all.)
> I suspect that some lute players did this and some avoided
it.
> There
> might be the odd piece that absolutely requires it. There
also
> might be
> some performance practice insights one could gain from
> experimenting
> with it, but due to the risk of wrist injury, I'd be
hesitant
to
> make a
> regular practice of using it all the time. Even in the
19th
> century, it
> wasn't universal. Sor, for one, disapproved of it.
> Chris
> [1]Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
> On Oct 1, 2015, 12:01:01 PM, G. C. wrote:
> One obscure feature of plucking which has always
fascinated
but
> eluded
> me is the technique of using also the thumb to play on the
lower
> strings. Supposedly mainly feasible on 6 course
instruments
and a
> narrow neck, it has apparently been in vogue and an open
"secret"
> for
> the initiated since the days of Francesco at least (see
famous
> painting
> by Giulio Campi on the cover of Doug's History of the Lute
if
it
> indeed
> depicts such a practice). I know that it is very common in
Rock,
> (where
> its so widespread, that it has to be meaningful somehow).
To
me,
> (classically trained), it looks bizarre, and more like
someone
> has
> learned to play the wrong way. But it has to have at least
some
> advantages, as it seems to be so popular (at least among
the
rock
> music
> pluckers). Not only for barrA", particularly chords where
the
> index
> presses on a fret in front of the fret that the thumb is
stopping
> look
> bewildering. Might there be an ergonomic/finger mechanical
> reason?
> (Concert playing for hours so thereby avoiding carpal
tunnel
> syndrome?)
> Is there someone here who could explain the inner workings
and/or
> advantages of this technique in a simple way or point to a
> website, are
> there any uses for it in lute-playing (skewed barrA"?),
and
does
> the
> practice have a consensus name?
> Best regards
> G
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References
1. mailto:[email protected]
2. http://le.luth.free.fr/pouce/index.html
3. mailto:[email protected]
4. mailto:[email protected]
5. mailto:[email protected]
6. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
7. https://yho.com/footer0
8. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
9. mailto:[email protected]
10. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
11. https://yho.com/footer0
12. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
