Yeah, I think we already discussed that 'sliced-through-the-holes' OptROM edge treatment (as well as the Facebook issue ;-) last summer...
@ Steve: Did you end up getting some of those Batten and Allen edge pins that D'Asaro uses, or are you using something else for the NEC etc.? m ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Adolph" <[email protected]> To: "Model 100 Discussion" <[email protected]> Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2017 10:32 AM Subject: Re: [M100] REX second source > Brian - keeping it short - I am aware that, with current PCB shops, > there is an easier way to go. I have inventory of existing designs, > and the existing design is validated. Grinding the PCBs is simple > enough, and I don't personally think it is worth a board spin when I > have 100 or so PCBs around. NEC versions don't need to be ground, but > they need very specific header pins to be soldered in place. > > > ..Steve > > On Tue, Jan 10, 2017 at 9:48 AM, Brian White <[email protected]> wrote: >> Steve, when you say you have to grind the boards, do you mean you grind the >> long sides down to cut the 28 large through holes in half? >> >> That right there is a great example of what I mean by letting the >> community/users help improve the design. >> If the cad file were up in a git repo, or just publicized anywhere any how, >> it doesn't have to be github, I could have told you since more than a year >> ago, that you can get those manufactured with the holes already cut in half. >> That's one of those whole pain in the neck steps 90% erased already, just >> from someone else telling you something they discovered and now you can >> incorporate it. >> >> You can specify the outside dimension to go right through the holes, and the >> router will do it, and leave just the right final outside dimension, with >> all those holes cut in half for you. That's how the figtronix boards come. >> >> When I build a figtronix board, all I have to do is barely sand it a little >> just to knock down the "rat bites" (breakaway tabs), and sometimes clean off >> these tiny little copper flags that hang off the side of some holes, left >> behind by the way the router cuts through the through hole plating. >> >> But that only takes a takes a few seconds one minute and the tools are just >> a sheet of sand paper on a flat surface. I use a cheap wood cutting board. >> Couple swipes and it's good to go. >> >> pics >> https://goo.gl/photos/i4DX5LEywTTSevQs6 >> >> That's what I mean by you're working too hard and worrying about things you >> don't have to worry about. I don't know how to help with 50 different things >> abouyt the design, but I know that one thing. Somone else knows one other >> thing, etc, etc. >> >> And, even though this is already better than having to grind all that board >> down, I bet it can still get even better. >> I *think* (I don't know), but I think you can also specify where the >> rat-bites go, within limits. So I think it's also possible with a board this >> small to make it only have 2 rat bites on the ends and have perfectly clean >> contacts all down the long edges. Or you might be able to make it put 4 >> total rat bites, but with 2 on each end and none on the sides. And then you >> can reduce the long dimension *slightly* to allow the board to fit in the >> socket without even cleaning up the board to sand down the rat bites flat. >> Could just break 'em off and go. No sanding at all. That's the kind of thing >> I would research and figure out just for my own satisfaction, and then when >> I have figured out how one does that, I'd tell you, or I'd do a submit >> request to submit changes to the cad files. Just like if I do figure that >> out, I'd tell FigTroniX and then the figtronix board gets that much better >> to use. >> >> That's a lot of labor and manual steps totally eliminated from the final >> design just from having users be able to contribute. You don't have to have >> it all perfect, you just get it up there and let everyone who has an >> interest in it help make it better over time. >> >> -- >> bkw >> >> On Mon, Jan 9, 2017 at 10:06 PM, Doug Jackson <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> Hi Steve, >>> >>> I agree that transferring would be work. I feel that separating the >>> hardware and software may be the path forward, especially if the hardware >>> design is proven. >>> >>> My clocks use a 240mm square PCB that I source from Pcbcart. Experience >>> has shown that they are cheaper than OSH part for volume. I normally order >>> boards as 60 to 100 units at a time to take advantage of volume discounts. >>> Same for parts, I have oearnt that volume discounts make sense in small >>> scale manufacturing. >>> >>> After surface reflow, all of my boards go through a test and firmware >>> loading jig. I published the design for one of the jigs on Instructables.com >>> >>> http://www.instructables.com/id/A-Programming-Jig-for-our-DougsWordClockcom-DeskC/ >>> this radicaly simplifies the firmware load. I am confident that I could >>> devel op something to do the CPLD load as well. >>> >>> From the perspective of manufacturing capacity, my workshop has >>> microscopes and logic analysers and grinders etc etc.. but it woud be >>> worthwhile figuring out how to modify the design so that there was no need >>> to rip spacers from wood, or grind boards and remove as many manual handling >>> steps as possible. >>> >>> Doug >>> >>> >>> On 10 January 2017 12:52:26 pm AEDT, Stephen Adolph <[email protected]> >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Doug, thanks for your note - read on...let's discuss. >>>> >>>> I'd be happy to put the board files on Oshpark, and place the >>>> software, firmware, test applications in a git, but that isn't enough. >>>> One needs to install the firmware and test the hardware afterwards.. >>>> and that assumes you can assemble a REX in the first place. Plus you >>>> need test jigs to do all that. Feasible, but a significant investment >>>> in time and learning. >>>> >>>> The biggest issues I see- >>>> >>>> * fine pitch soldering >>>> * grinding the PCBs down so that they can be plugged >>>> * sourcing spacers - I slab cedar strips using my table saw.... 0.050 >>>> inches >>>> * firmware - it is stable now, but in general you must understand >>>> RTL,VHDL and CPLD programming >>>> * REX software is quite complicated. it gets right in to the OS via 4 >>>> separate hooks and significantly affects boot up. it can be a real >>>> challenge to debug. >>>> * Keeping ahead of changes and how they work in all 5 supported models >>>> is a bit of work also. One needs to have hardware examples of all 5 >>>> models to do the testing. >>>> >>>> >>>> The equipment I rely on in general includes >>>> >>>> 1) a bench grinder/sander >>>> 2) a 15x binocular microscope >>>> 3) a Tek scope >>>> 4) a logic analyzer >>>> 5) my hardware jig(s) for installing firmware and testing the hardware >>>> (M100, PC8201 variant) >>>> 6) xilinx CPLD toolset (easy to get but you have to learn to compile >>>> and install CPLD code >>>> 7) a basic weller temp controlled iron + solder paste in a syringe >>>> >>>> If there were zero design changes, here are the steps to assemble a >>>> working REX. >>>> >>>> 1) assemble REX - grind PCB, hand solder CPLD, Flash, power supply, >>>> clean. >>>> 2) install firmware - using Xilinx tools and known good firmware >>>> binary, install binary image into CPLD. REX mounted in test jig. >>>> There are 3 firmware versions. M100, T200, NEC. >>>> 3) test REX - run stand alone test software on appropriate Model T / >>>> rework failed units. >>>> 4) install application >>>> 5) final test >>>> >>>> Further development of REX is more involved obviously. Maybe at this >>>> point future development is limited to software only, and it may be >>>> safe to assume the hardware and firmware are fixed. >>>> >>>> Anyhow, as I said, it is feasible to transfer this to someone, but I >>>> feel like it is a fair bit of work to transfer as well! >>>> >>>> Steve >>>> >>>> On Mon, Jan 9, 2017 at 8:26 PM, John R. Hogerhuis <[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> I think the only fundamental problem right now is availability, since >>>>> Steve >>>>> has been busy with real life. Rex is not something you can just git >>>>> clone >>>>> and make. Part of it could be, of course. >>>>> >>>>> Component ordering, fabrication, assembly, test, order taking, shipping >>>>> is >>>>> the current issue. >>>>> >>>>> -- John. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- >>> Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. >> >> >
