Hi Tim,
I have the standard view for Mail. I have all my cursors tracking one
another and I have nothing special changed in the Web category. I use DOM
order for navigation. I suggested the move window menu because many people are
not aware you can do this. I completely forgot about it until I stumbled
across those commands while training someone who asked me about VoiceOver's
ability to move objects and windows around the screen.
Oddly enough, I spent some time messing with this and it's hit or miss. I
can consistently get it to work sometimes, but other times, I can't seem to
drop the mailbox onto the favorites bar. I need to try this with someone
sighted here so I can find out what might be going on.
Take Care
John D. Panarese
Director
Mac for the Blind
Tel, (631) 724-4479
Email, [email protected]
Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com
APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL FOR MAC OSX Mountain Lion and LION
AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
On May 26, 2013, at 11:19 AM, Tim Kilburn <[email protected]> wrote:
> John,
>
> I'm wondering
>
> • what your VO settings are, specifically navigation and web.
> • what view you're Mail is in.
> • Is your Preview pane active or not.
>
> I have made this work on occasion but after seeing others frustration in this
> thread was attempting to play with things a little to determine why things
> might be not working for them. In my testing, I was unable to make the Drag
> and Drop to Favourites work for me either. Kind of interesting considering
> that I did make it work in the past and have sent responses assisting others.
> Anyway, I'll put some notes below on my experiences:
>
> • You must Interact with the Mailbox to be able to mark it for Drag and Drop.
> • Items that are expandable usually cannot be dragged around. These are
> items such as Sent mail that is expandable due to the fact that you have
> multiple Mailboxes within the Mail app.
> • When I mark something to drag, focus moves to the Messages Table of that
> Mailbox, so extra steps of uninteracting must be performed prior to moving
> over to the Favourites bar. I tried changing VO cursor settings to affect
> this with no real success.
> • VO marks the item, drags it but then says that it was unable to drop it on
> the Favourites bar.
> • I already have eight items in my Favourite bar so thought that maybe that
> was a limit, so I pulled one item out. No change in behaviour although I did
> have to ask my daughter to put the item back in because I couldn't get the
> Drag and Drop to work properly.
> • No joy whether I use the old fashioned VO-cmd-space Drag and Drop method
> instead of the VO-comma/VO-period method.
> • In fact, I had to restart my MBP at one point as my daughter said that the
> Trackpad button wasn't responding properly even when she was trying things,
> probably got messed up with all my on/off playing.
>
> Any specifics that you have that could assist in this would be appreciated.
>
> Have a good one.
>
> Later...
>
> Tim Kilburn
> Fort McMurray, AB Canada
>
> On 2013-05-25, at 10:37 AM, John Panarese <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> There are VO commands to move windows around. If you use VO-shift-accent
>> , you will access the menus for dong this. You might want to experiment
>> with them to see if it helps.
>>
>>
>> Take Care
>>
>> John D. Panarese
>> Director
>> Mac for the Blind
>> Tel, (631) 724-4479
>> Email, [email protected]
>> Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com
>>
>> APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL FOR MAC OSX Mountain Lion and LION
>>
>> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
>>
>> MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On May 25, 2013, at 6:39 AM, Jürgen Fleger <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> Just for fun I tried again to move a mailbox to the favoritesbar in
>>> Mountain Lion OS X 10.8.3 by using VO + komma. I closed the preview pan,
>>> maximized the window and pressed VO + Shift + F2 to get the window even
>>> more to the foreground. It didn't help at all. The message: the window
>>> could be hidden by something.
>>> So Brian, unfortunately you are not alone. And I agree that Apple could
>>> have and should have fixed a whole bunch of issues which occurred since
>>> Lion and went on in Mountain Lion.
>>> The only way to bring Apple to see and fix these issues is to send e-mails
>>> to
>>> [email protected]
>>> as often as we can and describe the issues as detailed as we can. That's my
>>> opinion.
>>> All the best
>>> Jürgen
>>>
>>> Am 25.05.2013 um 01:39 schrieb Ricardo Walker <[email protected]>:
>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> Just curious, do you have the preview pane open in Mail? I don't, I'm
>>>> wondering if this might be why your having difficulty moving a mailbox to
>>>> favorites, an I'm not?
>>>>
>>>> Ricardo Walker
>>>> [email protected]
>>>> Twitter:@apple2thecore
>>>> www.appletothecore.info
>>>>
>>>> On May 24, 2013, at 6:46 PM, Brian Fischler <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hey John,
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, I did exactly what you said to do, and yes, the favorites bar was
>>>>> showing, spent hours on this trying everything VO comma, and the old way
>>>>> VO shift space bar, and couldn't get anything to work. Finally, I gave up
>>>>> and had a sighted person come over and do it in 2 seconds. These are the
>>>>> frustrating things with VO, and would be nice if Apple would address. As
>>>>> far as I believe, there hasn't been one single improvement to VO since
>>>>> Mountain Lion rolled out, and I can only get the same answer from Apple
>>>>> accessibility so many times on several issues. We are aware of the
>>>>> problem, but can't say when it will be fixed. Something so simple as them
>>>>> reversing the web spots so when you click VO command right bracket takes
>>>>> you right instead of left, would have been nice. If they can't fix that
>>>>> which to me seems something very basic to fix, and worked correctly in
>>>>> Lion, I don't put a lot of stock in any VO improvements until the next
>>>>> operating system comes out. I get that only a very small percentage of
>>>>> people use VO, and that Apple cannot commit a great number of resources
>>>>> to it, but just be honest, instead of treating us like idiots waiting for
>>>>> a fix. Don't get me wrong I do appreciate Apple's commitment to
>>>>> accessibility, it's the leading us to think there will be improvements
>>>>> that annoys me.
>>>>> On May 24, 2013, at 4:05 PM, John Panarese <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Brian,
>>>>>> It isn't easy, but adding mailboxes to the favorites bar is doable with
>>>>>> VoiceOver. You must be sure the favorites bar is showing first off, and
>>>>>> then, be sure you mark the mailbox for drag and drop and then navigate
>>>>>> to the favorites bar itself to drop the mailbox. I don't think you need
>>>>>> to interact with the favorites bar though to drop the mailbox.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Take Care
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John D. Panarese
>>>>>> Director
>>>>>> Mac for the Blind
>>>>>> Tel, (631) 724-4479
>>>>>> Email, [email protected]
>>>>>> Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL FOR MAC OSX Mountain Lion and LION
>>>>>>
>>>>>> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
>>>>>>
>>>>>> MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On May 24, 2013, at 1:42 PM, Brian Fischler <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hey Nicholas,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You must be one of the very few lucky ones to never have had an I hate
>>>>>>> my mac day. I tried exactly what you suggested, even quit every
>>>>>>> application closed everything and restarted my mac, then opened mail
>>>>>>> first after a restart, and still got the message VO cannot drag the
>>>>>>> item as the item might be hidden. I then did everything the old
>>>>>>> fashioned way called someone who could see and had them come over. They
>>>>>>> confirmed that nothing was blocking the mailbox I was trying to move,
>>>>>>> and I was still getting the same message. I had them drag and drop the
>>>>>>> mailbox using the mouse, and they were able to do it in 2 seconds, so
>>>>>>> yes, this is obviously a bug with Voiceover which leads to having a I
>>>>>>> hate my mac day, as I hate not being able to do something so simple
>>>>>>> that should take me two seconds.
>>>>>>> On May 24, 2013, at 6:55 AM, Nicholas Parsons
>>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've never had an "I hate Mac day" myself.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> When it says something is hidden, I think it usually means there's
>>>>>>>> some other window or application blocking that item on the screen.
>>>>>>>> Using VoiceOver it is of course very difficult to get an idea of what
>>>>>>>> this might be. So what usually works for me is just closing that
>>>>>>>> window or application and opening it again. Also try closing any other
>>>>>>>> windows you might have open. Use the windows chooser (VO-F2 twice
>>>>>>>> quickly) to see if there are any other windows or notifications open.
>>>>>>>> Try quitting all other applications before you try dragging and
>>>>>>>> dropping again.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The commands you're using should work. VO-COMMA and VO-PERIOD in full
>>>>>>>> screen mode nearly always works for me.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Best of luck.
>>>>>>>>
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