actually i do believe a good way of laying pressure on them, would be keeping educating them about our needs. But then again on the other hand till that is done we got to find other ways of getting where we want. For me personally it means reading a ungodly lots of medical books so i can end up nursing. It takes me lots of time scanning the books in, after that prove reading them the list goes on and on and on, would it be nicer if we had all our books as ebooks? that goes with out saying. But will it ever happen? i doubt it, the main reason is this. there are lots of books out there and having them all digitalized is simply not realistic. I at least know that some of the books i read for cutiesleeps, could not be found in any digitalized version till i had scanned it in,"das boot" Same goes for some air plane books. However in denmark at least, there are ways round that you can go down, borrow a book at your local library, scan it in and deliver it back, i don't know how it work in other countries, but am sure that there are similar solutions? :) As Donna says apple have made the iPhone accessible, could it be done for windows as well? both yes and no, it is a matter about how the operating system boots up. And on a last note, of course we should never under any circumstance accept less than what a sighted person can get if it is at all doable to make it work for us, but i think it is hard for some sighted persons too understand how easy it would be to make their products work for us.
/sandi On 8/8/13, Donna Goodin <doniado...@me.com> wrote: > Hi all, > > I really have to agree with Eric, here. In response to Barry, what Apple > did with the iPhone 3Gs was to make a main-stream device accessible to us. > And yes, that still has the potential to level the playing field . But the > playing field is hardly level if Apple is the only company doing this, if > for no other reason than what that means is that blind consumers would only > have one choice. I agree with Bary. I love my Apple products and have > absolutely no interest in personally owning a Kindle. But I work with lots > of students who do have them. Kindle does a lot more in textbooks than > other e-text providers, which means that people will want to buy these > devices for school. Isn't it reasonable to strive to have the same level of > choice in our mobile technology as our sighted peers? Sandy is right, > there's a big gap between the ideal and the current reality, but that's a > big reason why I think it's worth doing everything we can to stop Amazon > from getting this waiver. Barry may be correct, and that all our comments > may be for naught. However, the only way we'll know is to try. > Best, > Donna > On Aug 8, 2013, at 5:01 AM, eric oyen <eric.o...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> and what is wrong with that? the powers that be try every way to keep us >> penned up, but I do not accept that. We have the right to be able to live >> the same as others (at least here in the U.S.). So, why should we accept >> anything less? >> >> -eric >> >> On Aug 7, 2013, at 2:16 PM, Barry Hadder wrote: >> >>> I recall a time not so long ago when i devices first became accessible, >>> everyone thinking how that was going to level the playing field. It’s >>> funny how quickly perspectives change. >>> >>> Now the bar has been raised even higher. The playing field will not be >>> level until blind people have access to every cheep piece of crap in >>> existence. >>> I should say that I’m happy with what Apple does and I have no desire to >>> use anything else. That said however, I certainly think that it would be >>> a very good think if other companies would realize the importance of >>> opening their products up to other segments of society and not excluding >>> them. I just don’t think that this is going to convince them. >>> >>> I don’t want to completely let Apple off the hook as it seems to me at >>> times that there are factions under their roof that don’t seem to >>> understand the importance of accessibility or what Voiceover is even used >>> for. On the other hand, I think that there is a much larger faction at >>> Apple that definitely gets it and that the evidence to support this is >>> over whelming. I realize that not every body can listen to them, but >>> there were some very impressive sessions at WWDC on the importance of >>> accessibility and how easy it really is to not only make an app usable to >>> a blind person, but make it a nice experience to use. >>> >>> I would like to suggest, that just maybe, if a government agency needs to >>> step in to private inderestry and dictate to a company how their product >>> is required to function, the result probably won’t be something you are >>> going to want to use. >>> >>> I think that we as a blind community have access to more information then >>> at any other time in history. And, while things can always be better, >>> maybe some gratitude is in order for the really good things that some >>> companies like Apple have done. >>> >>> >>> On Aug 7, 2013, at 12:36 PM, Richard Ring <richr...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>> And, let's face it! Not all blind people can afford i devices, nor >>>> should they have to! Having a relatively inexpensive Ereader would >>>> really help to level the playing field! >>>> >>>> >>>> You can have an off day, but you can't have a day off! ---The Art of >>>> Fielding >>>> Sent from my Mac Book Pro >>>> richr...@gmail.com >>>> >>>> On Aug 7, 2013, at 12:21 PM, Eugenia Firth <gigifi...@me.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi there >>>>> Yes, and we all know which "disability" they are talking about, and >>>>> it's not the disabled they are talking about either. They are talking >>>>> about the blind, but of course, they didn't say so. They might as well >>>>> have. After all, most of the other disabilities can read the print. >>>>> When I heard about this law, I had a feeling this kind of thing was >>>>> going to start with the "we can't" people. >>>>> >>>>> Hey, I guess you guys noticed how they want to solve the accessibility >>>>> problem, right! They want to let Apple carrying them along by saying we >>>>> can all use iPads etc.! >>>>> Regards, >>>>> Gigi >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> Gigi >>>>> >>>>> On Aug 7, 2013, at 10:02 AM, Mike Arrigo <n0...@charter.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I can't believe the FCC would even consider that. They should say, >>>>>> absolutely not. These devices must be made accessible, end of story. >>>>>> Original message: >>>>>>> Hello all: >>>>>> >>>>>>> In follow-up to Karen's post last night, I am posting information >>>>>>> regarding FCC's request for comments on this issue. I hope that many >>>>>>> of you will take the time to comment. >>>>>>> Best, >>>>>>> Donna >>>>>>> Request for Comment on Petition for Class Waiver of Accessibility >>>>>>> Rules for ACS >>>>>> >>>>>>> On August 1, 2013, the Federal Communication Commission (FCC) >>>>>>> released a Public Notice requesting comment on a petition filed by >>>>>>> the Coalition of E-Reader Manufacturers. The Coalition requests that >>>>>>> the Commission waive its rules requiring equipment used for advanced >>>>>>> communications services (ACS) to be accessible by people with >>>>>>> disabilities. The Coalition states that, although e-readers are >>>>>>> equipment that consumers can use for ACS, they are designed primarily >>>>>>> for reading. >>>>>> >>>>>>> To distinguish e-readers from tablets and other devices that would >>>>>>> not be subject to the waiver request, the Coalition requests a waiver >>>>>>> for e-readers that have the following features: >>>>>> >>>>>>> (1) they have no LCD screen; >>>>>>> (2) they have no camera; >>>>>>> (3) they are not offered or shipped to consumers with built-in ACS >>>>>>> client applications and their manufacturers do not develop ACS >>>>>>> applications for their respective devices, though the devices may >>>>>>> include a browser and social media applications; and >>>>>>> (4) they are marketed to consumers as reading devices and promotional >>>>>>> material does not tout the capability to access ACS. >>>>>> >>>>>>> Comment Deadline: September 3, 2013 >>>>>>> Reply Comment Deadline: September 13, 2013 >>>>>> >>>>>>> Links to the Public Notice (including filing instructions): >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> (PDF) >>>>>>> http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-13-1686A1.pdf >>>>>>> <http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-13-1686A1.pdf> >>>>>>> (Word) >>>>>>> http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-13-1686A1.doc >>>>>>> <http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-13-1686A1.doc> >>>>>>> (Text) >>>>>>> http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-13-1686A1.txt >>>>>>> <http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-13-1686A1.txt> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Link to the Coalition Petition (May 15, 2013): >>>>>>> http://apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/view?id=7022314526 >>>>>>> <http://apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/view?id=7022314526> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Link to the Letter Supplementing the Coalition Petition (July 17, >>>>>>> 2013): http://apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/view?id=7520931307 >>>>>>> <http://apps.fcc.gov/ecfs/document/view?id=7520931307> >>>>>> >>>>>>> For further information, please contact Eliot Greenwald at (202) >>>>>>> 418-2235 oreliot.greenw...@fcc.gov >>>>>>> <mailto:eliot.greenw...@fcc.gov><mailto:eliot.greenw...@fcc.gov >>>>>>> <mailto:eliot.greenw...@fcc.gov>>; or Rosaline Crawford at (202) >>>>>>> 418-2075 orrosaline.crawf...@fcc.gov >>>>>>> <mailto:rosaline.crawf...@fcc.gov><mailto:rosaline.crawf...@fcc.gov >>>>>>> <mailto:rosaline.crawf...@fcc.gov>>. >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>>> send an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> To post to this group, send email to >>>>>>> macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries >>>>>>> <http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries>. >>>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out >>>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out>. >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>>> an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. >>>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MacVisionaries" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >>> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >>> >>> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MacVisionaries" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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