On 9/18/2010 8:46 AM, Felipe Contreras wrote:
Huh? I think nowadays upstart can be considered deprecated:
http://0pointer.de/blog/projects/systemd.html
just because someone is doing an experiment doesn't mean other things are
deprecated....
Ok, I thought that was obvious, but I guess time will tell.
it's far from obvious... really.
systemd has design issues which have to be hashed out obviously (Fedora is
punting on it for F14 for a reason)
upstart has license/contribution issues which are not pretty
Fedora is putting it on F14 because F13 was practically out when
systemd was announced.
Fedora is NOT using systemd in 14 ..only in 15 maybe
MeeGo currently has a highly customized boot process, optimized for speed.
At this point, if we were to switch,
upstart matches that closer than systemd does.... so upstart would be a more
logical change if we were to change.
If you want speed, you need a customized boot process in traditional
yes I know a thing or two about boot speed.... so far MeeGo is one of
the fastest booting Linux OSes in the market
init systems (sysvinit, upstart), because everything gets started, so
then you need to pick and choose what really gets started, and when.
that's regurgitating systemd propaganda... but that does not make it true ;)
But systemd turns the problem around; nothing gets started, unless
it's really used, so there's less need to customize (if any).
systemd turns it into a worst case problem unfortunately, because now
you hit the start latency ALL THE TIME.
this is what I meant with design issues; systemd's design isn't going to
give you a super fast boot. Now
maybe they'll fix it sometime in the future.... but today it makes
systemd entirely uninteresting for booting fast.
yes it'll boot faster than the really really slow existing Fedora, but
that's not an interesting benchmark point.
the benchmark point should be the state of the art, not the worst of the
industry.
It's ok to have multiple competing technologies; that's one of the ways
innovation happens in open source.. competition.
Sure, but we are not using any, so I don't see why we should assume
that upstart will be used. I think both approaches need to be
carefully and equally considered.
oh trust me we are looking at all options, very very carefully. That's
why I said that upstart currently is more likely than systemd,
but frankly, for 1.2 we might also just stick with what we have now.. it
works and is fast.
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