Hello, Without an vitriol or flaming I hope to make a few points: What John Mort wrote on the topic fits me well too. Thanks John!
I too see PC's and devices as tools and I just use either what tool I know is best for the job, or the tool that I have sufficient skills to use. It takes time to learn new things and no one has time to know it all. No one should waste the time of those on this list just to say they hate MS, etc. But it has happened here more than a few times and it doesn't color the MHVLUG well if allowed. Frankly, some of the stuff written attacking my agnostic side of the fence wasn't well thought out by those that lowered their rhetorical standards to merely a rant about how antiquated/evil/? some non-Linux software/companies seem to them. Personally I don't think everything free is all honey and spice as a rule, but you won't read me attacking anyone that wears rose-colored lenses. Please consider doing us agnostics the return courtesy. I attend and read because I want to know Linux better, but that doesn't mean to the point of exclusion of other solutions. One thing this group is good at is informing each other of highly specialized tools or the right programming approach for problems that themselves are not usually of the type that can be a help to Linux newcomers. To let folks know a bit about my background and how I fit in here, please allow me to tell you a few short things. There is a purpose for writing about my background. So,... I regularly attend the monthly presentations, but find them over my head at times (gasp!). I both attended and worked in Computing Services at Carnegie Mellon for many years and at the time I needed to be fluent in MS, Apple, SunOS, Solaris, plus Cisco, etc. So it's not every day that Linux topics seem so removed from my ability to use them in my life. But I have found that a number of the bits people here help each other out on either require working in a enterprise environment or require programming skills to implement. Sadly, I don't see myself as a programmer, nor do I think other mortal newcomers to the LUG would either. Continuing on to clear up a few mis-conceptions that were paraded here. The MHCUG (PC users group) does charge $35/yr for membership. But it has nothing to do with a desire not to be free. All dues go towards paying for the meeting spaces we use, group insurance against slip and fall type lawsuits, and a few other minor things that keep the gov't happy to allow us to operate as a 501(c)(3). We worked very very hard last year to lower our costs of meeting space and found ourselves at the barrier of lowest cost we can find anywhere. And as an aside, the entire MHCUG is near a precipice of heading for extinction since even the $35 doesn't cover our costs. So those posts that stuck out their tongues at the MHCUG need to understand just how lucky you are that you don't have to pay for your space, or insurance or ISP fees, etc. And no, it didn't seem nice as to me as the President of the MHCUG to find ourselves part of a flame post. And lastly I would like to tentatively vote to keep allowing the digest type of subscription. But after the recent posts I'm not sure as a digest reader it's worth it. The digest is nearly impossible to read by way of seeking the signal vs. the noise. I find very few of the posts here bother to trim off the prior message and .sig files when replying. So perhaps it would be easier to just go without digest and then have better threading. Sean, you have my support in whatever decision you need to make to make this work. Jeff Dowley [email protected] MHCUG President -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Monday, July 26, 2010 7:02 PM To: [email protected] Subject: mhvlug Digest, Vol 35, Issue 32 Today's Topics: 1. Re: We need to redefine ourselves, or re read the definition that we already have (John D. Mort) 2. Re: We need to redefine ourselves, or re read the definition that we already have (Michael Quick) 3. Re: NYC DebConf "Debian Day" August 1 Sunday 10 AM to 6:40 PM (Chris Knadle) 4. Re: We need to redefine ourselves, or re read the definition that we already have (Chris Knadle) 5. The preponderance of OS X in the Linux/SysAdmin community (Derek J. Balling) 6. list suggestion (Dan Simoes) 7. Re: list suggestion (Joseph Apuzzo) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2010 16:48:25 -0400 From: "John D. Mort" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [mhvlug] We need to redefine ourselves, or re read the definition that we already have > Sorry for the rant, but the group is at a crossroads. Open source > computing is changing so quickly that we need to remember our roots and > objectives. > I don't know. I consider myself a computer pragmatist and have no qualms or hard feelings about using proprietary software when there aren't any reasonable Open Source options or when the proprietary product is superior enough to the Open Source alternatives to make it worth paying or subscribing as necessary to gain access to it. But while I enjoy poking fun as Microsoft and often dislike the manner in which they wield the influence they have over the computing world, I have no real venom toward the company and would be inclined to argue that my life is ultimately better in a world where they exist as they do than if there never was such a company. I just don't share the venom toward them that I see expressed sometimes. I accept that I'm in the minority here, but I don't believe that I'm the only person with this view. For myself, this list is primarily a resource for handling problems with Linux, even when said problems revolve around getting Linux and Windows (or some other proprietary system) to play nice. As a result, I tend to take more of a larger tent view of what this group is than what you've expressed here. Maybe I'm wrong about that, but I figured I ought to speak up in case others felt the same way. -- John D. Mort http://john.mort.net _______________________________________________ Mid-Hudson Valley Linux Users Group http://mhvlug.org http://mhvlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/mhvlug Upcoming Meetings (6pm - 8pm) MHVLS Auditorium Aug 4 - Samba Sep 1 - BOINC Oct 6 - Creating Firefox Extensions
