Poco an all, You are right also. I understand Rupert's point of view. Finally we must conclude that things are as 'the right machine at the right place', ram included. That's is how we must talk about. Carlos B. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----- Original Message ----- From: "poco baya" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 4:12 PM Subject: Re: [microhydro] Re: Ram Pump, Alternative energy? Ram Pumps-alternative energy, not! One of the biggest problems of promoting appropriate technology is that often those who have the power and ability to build appropriate technology machines have personally no need for them This can (and does) affect their perception of the value of the machine for others. Rupert Evans and Carlos B. are both very knowledgeable regarding waterpower, and they agree that the ram pump is not for them, but they do not say which method of pumping they would rather have. I assume that they would not prefer to carry water uphill, as the grateful boy had to do in "A ram pump story" before they installed a ram. So, one must assume that they expect to use an electric pump. That presupposes having a dependable electrical supply, reliable voltage, the money to pay the bills, someone to repair it, or the money to replace it before the garden or animals suffer from lack of water. There are many people for whom none of these things are available, but who could very profitably use a ram pump. The important thing is to know how to keep it running. I think that this is far easier with a ram pump in rural areas than an electric pump. Especially if one does not have electricity. We all use machine that we don't completely understand on a daily basis-like this computer I am using now. Does that stop us? There are vast areas where a ram is not "alternative energy" at all, but the only practical means to pump water for those who live there. Isn't that what we are talking about? Poco Carlos Bonifetti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Rupert, Thanks for interesting history about ram pumps. My feeling about ram pumps applications are like yours. It's very time consuming the explanation about how it works and kow 'must be' installed for people that don't have knowledge about hydraulics. Regards, Carlos -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ----- Original Message ----- From: "Evans Engineering" To: Sent: Monday, May 23, 2005 7:21 AM Subject: RE: [microhydro] Re: Portable Ram Pump: Good Idea! > Hello from Cornwall UK, > It may be of interest to the group to know that the 'Hydraulic Ram' was > first simultaneously invented or the principal discovered in 1772 by a > Bristol Plumber and a certain Whitehurst. I think the latter > demonstrated it to 'The Royal Institution' in London. The Montgolfiers > either improved or discovered the principal a few years later in France. > Then began a number of improvements by Keith, Fyffe, Davies and John > Blake. My own family company Joseph Evans & Sons of Wolverhampton UK > were one of the largest manufacturers in the UK and I recently came > across an 1864 'Evans' ram that was still working well. Despite this, I > don't particularly like rams for rural water supply because despite > their long life if made well, they are difficult to install well and for > farmers to understand. Small obstructions or changes to the delivery > conditions can make them stop for no apparent reason. Waterwheel and > simple turbine driven pumps can work from the far more abundant sites > with as little as 500 mm of drive head. These devices are more complex > but easier to understand and much more flexible (since they cannot > stall, they simply slow down while the torque increases) The project in > PNG as with many others in developing countries was an unmitigated > disaster as far as I know. The funding agency concerned paid for the > rams to be built but not for the installation and long term maintenance. > May I strongly suggest that those who are interested in this field, > don't get carried away with the 'magic' of a 'Ram', because like > 'biogas' plants, they require a bit more care if they are to work for a > 100 years or so. Sorry for the 'ramble' but I thought I might stick my > oar in on this one, > Bye > Rupert > Does your company feature in the microhydro business directory at http://microhydropower.net/directory ? If not, please register free of charge and be exposed to the microhydro community world wide! NOTE: The advertisements in this email are added by Yahoogroups who provides us with free email group services. The microhydro-group does not endorse products or support the advertisements in any way. More information on micro hydropower at http://microhydropower.net To unsubscribe: send empty message to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo! 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