| And by the way, as I recall the conversation about rinsing dishes ended as follows: you do not have to rinse dishes before loading them into the dishwasher unless they will sit in the dishwasher more than a day, in which event you should rinse them.
Scott On Jul 25, 2025, at 2:12 PM, Mail Admin via Mifnet <mifnet@lists.mifnet.com> wrote:
For heaven's sakes Bob, you and I have been in the Mifnet group for years now, and I need to challenge you on the comment that Mifnet always has a "left-wing bias" . Sometimes the conversations take a so-called "liberal" bent; sometimes they have taken a "conservative" bent. I personally have seen all kinds of conservative and liberal comments and posts over the years. Don't you recall the frequent and long posts about politics and the economy by Vaughn Cordle? I don't know why he dropped off, he often triggered vigorous debate on the Mifnet, including from myself.
Doesn't make one bit of difference to me what kind of political views you or anyone else in this group hold, they are all informative for me, which is why I hang on as a member, but less frequently post. Sometimes I agree, sometimes I disagree with posts. Sometimes I post what I understand as the facts of an issue, as in recently on Mexico. Sometimes I "delete" if it is a continuous same issue/same thought from one member --- my privilege and yours. As David always reminds us, you can filter messages if you choose. I personally do not filter and appreciate reading all views. I do lament the fact that Mifnet membership is dwindling because it kept me somewhat in touch with colleagues I respect and enjoy --- for example, Bill Callaway this week and yourself.
And Randy, if you joined Mifnet thinking it would only be about aviation and aerospace issues --- no politics or diversions --- I would like to inform you that many times we on the Mifnet tend to wander into topics that have absolutely nothing to do with aviation/aerospace. Mifnet founder Paul Mifsud and I went on a multi-day splurge of posts about dishwashers and whether to rinse or not dishes before loading. It was great fun, I thought entertaining at least for Paul and me --- others joined in too. In fact, I miss the days when those kind of "NNN" discussions happened. Thanks to David, they are now labelled as such so others so inclined can ignore.
We have all grown, in my view, way too serious about everything these days, and need to step back and just enjoy engagement with friends and colleagues who of course have differing points of view. That said, I agree with David (who I send my great appreciation for his continued maintenance of the Mifnet), the title of this discussion on Buttigieg/DEI and the journalism qualities of the New York Post has run its course. Rgds, Roz
Wait a minute David, as there are a few things that still need to be said on this topic.
Randy - as a long-time Mifnet member, I can say without hesitation that your recognition of the left-wing bias of this group is absolutely on target. Unfortunately this condition has IMO too often led to groupthink and suppression of non-conforming views. More seriously, it has also inhibited participation and discussion on the Mifnet and may well contribute to its demise, tho I personally hope that's not the case. But it is what it is, and I don't expect it to change because it appears to reflect the imbedded political views of most of the individual members.
David, nothing in your post(s) caused the Mifnet's political bias, which has instead been alive and flourishing for years, so you can stop apologizing. Everyone appreciates your diligent efforts to steer the ship in a constructive direction, even when difficult or impossible.
And Doug, I appreciate your latest post, and particularly its constructive tone. I will just say that nothing I said in this thread is related to Southwest Airlines, instead it reflects my personal reaction to several members' dismissive and even inflammatory reactions to the use of the conservative (and therefore reviled) New York Post as a source of criticism of Sec. Buttigieg. I found it rather astonishing that several posters on a professional forum would think the article should be rejected simply because it came from the Post (wink, wink) as opposed to providing evidence of any factual inaccuracies.
Bob K Hi Randy, It’s certainly not meant to be that way, and I apologize for the distraction. As with any discussion list, we occasionally become focused on topics that have limited appeal. I should know better by now. All, May I kindly suggest that this topic has run through whatever mileage it had and that we should move on? Many thanks to all, DW Just an observation. As a pretty new member of this group, I don’t like to lead with my chin. But it seems way too much time is spent on politics. The commentary leads me to believe the Mifnet is the aviation arm of the DNC. Just sayin’. RJE Ah, now the real truth comes out. Anything from the New York Post must be ignored not because it's factually incorrect (for which there was no showing) but simply because it supposedly reflects the wrong political views. Who needs facts or even the First Amendment? We can just rely on Democrat Doug to specify what sources are acceptable for the Mifnet to use! I won’t withdraw this comment: the NY Post story is indeed HOGWASH. This is not a legitimate news source. It’s a right wing political propaganda entertainment source that loves to beat up on Democrats and is trying to get noticed and get clicks to survive, like everyone in that crowded space. This is not new. This is not controversial. Once you get past the ridiculous headline and lead paragraphs, there is some semblance of balance and fairness to the piece, complete with comment from former Secretary Buttigieg’s spokesperson. So at least there’s that. Bob K, I withdraw my comment with apologies. I don’t want to invest the time, and lack the patience, to try to rebut the claims. Others have commented on the veracity (or not) of the claims, and the source. Notwithstanding its aviation connection (I guess), I do wonder why Dr Wardell chose to start a political string on the Mifnet, and with an article from the New York Post to boot (a newspaper I used to read on trips home on Metro North for the amusement and the puzzles). Now he’s trying to use an AI search function as an arbiter, which I don’t think I am prepared to accept - like Wikipedia, it may be "directionally correct” as a colleague used to say, but who knows? I’ll try hard to keep my knee-jerk reactions to myself in future.
I'm curious Scott, how do you know "This is hogwash"? Do you have a counter-source to the New York Post article? Personally I don't know for sure if Buttigieg "shelled out tens of billions on a DEI agenda", tho it sounds at least plausible given his well-known political leanings. In any case, some evidence supporting your "hogwash" claim would be a lot more informative to the readers than a drive-by smear. Dr Wardell Scott
“WASHINGTON — Former Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg failed to replace outdated air traffic control systems while in office — with his agency instead shelling out tens of billions of dollars on a DEI agenda, according to federal spending records and airline industry insiders. “In one meeting, Buttigieg — who is said to be eyeing a 2028 presidential run — told industry executives that air traffic control upgrades would just allow them to fly more planes, “and so why would that be in his interest?” sources said.” --------------------------------------------------------------------------
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