Thinking in relatively strict class categories is what both the English and the Indian societies have in common, generally speaking, of course. For various different reasons though, historically speaking, I mean. Now why do we prefer to engage with the why- questions? Better you know the devil before asking how to get him out of your system. Well done, Lee.
On 6 Jul., 13:19, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote: > Hey Gabby, > > Although I initialy agree with that, I think that the root causes of > poverty can be said to be much the same the world over. > > I was poor when I was was a child, not so much nowadays, although I > still may my hard weeks and months. Why is this? Quite simply, it is > being born into a poor family. > > On 6 July, 12:00, gabbydott <[email protected]> wrote: > > > True, Lee, but then the political reasons for being poor usually > > differ from an individual in England and an individual in, let's say, > > India. Even though the individuals' experience of suffering from > > hunger might be comparable on the physical level, the question of who > > is responsible for the present situation and how it can be avoided in > > the future, must allow for differing answers. > > > On 6 Jul., 11:00, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > > wrote: > > > > You are correct, but I do think that if you can't aford food then you > > > are poor wherever you reside. > > > > On 5 July, 10:34, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > You are correct Vam. Our poor, and by that I mean those in North > > > > America(I think a family of four making less then 24,000/yr) aren't > > > > really poor by international standards. I was talking about the poor > > > > I know. Ironically, as we move toward socialism, they will become > > > > more dependent and poorer then ever. The pot bellied, malnourished > > > > kids from other countries I've little empathy with because, as you > > > > say, I can't fathom their circumstances. I understand India has a > > > > serious problem with this. Despite all the complaining from Chomski > > > > types, we really don't have much of a problem like that here in the > > > > States. Hunger exists, of course, but not near as much here as in > > > > other places. We're a fat country in more ways then one. > > > > > dj > > > > > On Sun, Jul 5, 2009 at 3:24 AM, Vamadevananda<[email protected]> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > " I understand the hardships of poor people." > > > > > > You do, Don, if you say so. But our understanding of the poor, of > > > > > poverty as existential phenomena played out in the human mind, > > > > > definitely takes us back to the purest in Marx' thought : that, it > > > > > qualifies, shapes and determines, the human mind, in ways and manner > > > > > that one who is not ( poor ) will find very very difficult, if not > > > > > impossible, to understand and appreciate. > > > > > > Such understanding usually causes us to lose our propensity to judge > > > > > the ( poor ) others, for one, and to pronounce a lot empathetically on > > > > > Government welfare prograes targeted atat the poor in our society, for > > > > > another. > > > > > > On Jul 5, 5:16 am, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >> I tend to be flippant at times. I wasn't, of course, referring to > > > > >> any > > > > >> specific persons in my 'loser parents' remarks. I understand the > > > > >> hardships of poor people. Much of my family is from rural Alabama > > > > >> and > > > > >> are 'poor.' Nobody is starving over there. These are country people > > > > >> and they work hard. They grow their own food, they go to church and > > > > >> help the old, the sick and the helpless. Salt of the earth. When I > > > > >> visit, I eat like a king; I love southern cooking. Because of this > > > > >> self-dependence, the matriarch(my mother's sister) has never been on > > > > >> welfare. The same can't be said for some of her grandchildren but > > > > >> when they visit(a lot) they always have plenty of food. It's the > > > > >> basic responsibility of the parent. Feed and cloth the kids. If > > > > >> someone isn't taking care of this then they can't handle the > > > > >> responsibility and CPS(or the > > > > >> grandparents/sister/brother/friend/neighbor) must take charge. I > > > > >> suppose one can refer to this as 'destroying the family' but I think > > > > >> what's best for the kids is more important. > > > > > >> Sickness can ruin the bank account. I get it. I feel compassion for > > > > >> them. They did what they had to do. When the money is gone there > > > > >> are > > > > >> services available to help them. It takes work and research and > > > > >> networking but help can be found. It will be harder now due to the > > > > >> recession but it can be done. Tenacity has it's rewards and there's > > > > >> nothing like a sick kid to galvanize normally apathetic people into > > > > >> lending a hand. This is why there is so much fraud involved in the > > > > >> health care industry. This is also why it is so hard to get help; > > > > >> you > > > > >> must convince people you're not scamming them. The burden of proof > > > > >> lies with you and it's difficult sometimes. People will say they're > > > > >> sorry and say no. You can't accept 'no.' You keep chugging away > > > > >> until they give you what you need or steer you to someone who can. > > > > > >> The problem with socialized medicine is the overall quality will > > > > >> suffer. It will also be harder to get help from benefactors(wealthy > > > > >> people) because it's their tax money being confiscated to pay for it. > > > > >> They'll look at you and your problems and feel compassion but send > > > > >> you > > > > >> off to use your 'free' health care. > > > > > >> Everything is hunky-dory until somebody gets sick. It's sad how many > > > > >> people actually think it's someone else's responsibility to take care > > > > >> of them or their kids when this happens. Asking beggiging for > > > > >> help(when it involves your kids, dignity goes out the window) is one > > > > >> thing. Demanding and expecting is another. It's contemptible. We > > > > >> must get away from this notion that the world owes you a living and > > > > >> get people to take responsibility for themselves and their families. > > > > >> More welfare or 'free lunches' are not the answer. > > > > > >> dj > > > > > >> On Sat, Jul 4, 2009 at 10:43 AM, iam deheretic<[email protected]> > > > > >> wrote: > > > > >> DoDon I know the logic is faulty, the problem is it mome true > > > > >> ththan I would > > > > >> > like to amit,, to quote mey sister who is staunchly anti > > > > >> > abortion.. "I can > > > > >> > only support one issue at timeme." > > > >> > > Personally I am for the womans right to chose and I will support > > > >> > > her no > > > > >> > matter what her choice is. > > > > > >> > As fono gooood loser parents go, I do know parents that have sold > > > > >> > everything > > > > >> > they had to take care of family, and we are talking in excess of > > > > >> > $2,500,000.oo paying medical bills, ending up getting assistance > > > > >> > to keep the > > > > >> > family alive... talk about loser penents ,, they lost everything. > > > > >> > I think it is called greed. > > > > >> > Allan > > > > > >> > On Sat, Jul 4, 2009 at 10:15 AM, Don Johnson <[email protected]> > > > > >> > wrote: > > > > > >> >> There is faulty logic here. You are assuming that if one opposes > > > > >> >> abortion then one also opposes feeding starving children. These > > > > >> >> are > > > > >> >> not mutually exclusive ideals. Far from it in fact. What I see > > > > >> >> happening is some conservatives believe people should take > > > > >> >> responsibility for their children. Wither that is in the womb or > > > > >> >> at > > > > >> >> home making sure they get enough to eat. If the kids are coming > > > > >> >> to > > > > >> >> school starving then CPS takes them away from their no good piece > > > > >> >> of > > > > >> >> garbage useless parents. The kids get fed and get out from under > > > > >> >> their loser parents. Everybody wins. > > > > > >> >> It would be like me saying since you(example here, keep pantyhose > > > > >> >> on) > > > > >> >> favor abortion then you must want to murder all hungry children. > > > > >> >> See, > > > > >> >> makes no since whatsoever. > > > > > >> >> For the record, I think women should be in control of their own > > > > >> >> bodies. I also think they should do it without tax payer money. > > > > >> >> So > > > > >> >> I'm pro-choice, anti-enable. Lunch at my kids school is a buck > > > > >> >> 75. > > > > >> >> If their parents can't afford that on their welfare checks > > > > >> >> something > > > > >> >> is very, very hinky and CPS should be involved. > > > > > >> >> dj > > > > > >> >> On Sat, Jul 4, 2009 at 2:16 AM, iam > > > > >> >> deheretic<[email protected]> wte: > > > > > >> >> > Those that are anti abortion andodon't rant on about the > > > > >> >> > starving > > > > >> >> > chirene > > > > > >> >> > that is very easy to explain. abortion they can rant about and it cost > > > > >> >> > them > > > > >> >> > very little, maybe a small donation and a little time, now > > > > >> >> > starving > > > > >> >> > children on the other hand takes a major commitment and to do > > > > >> >> > it would > > > > >> >> > require a major out lay of cash. as well as a major outlay of > > > > >> >> > time.. so > > > > >> >> > the > > > > >> >> > out lay of money and time are the major factors in the choice > > > > >> >> > of what to > > > > >> >> > support. > > > > >> >> > Allan > > > > > >> >> > On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 8:50 PM, retiredjim34 > > > > >> >> > <[email protected]> > > > > >> >> > wrote: > > > > > >> >> >> Lee - an interesting thread; thanks for initiating it. > > > > >> >> >> y have tritried to understand why there is evil in this > > > > >> >> >> world, > > > > >> >> >> How can it be reconciled with an all powerful, all good God. > > > > >> >> >> In all > > > > >> >> >> cases known to me the reasoning looks at the question from > > > > >> >> >> afar, much > > > > >> >> >> as another god might look at it. The answer usually begins by > > > > >> >> >> setting > > > > >> >> >> up a continuum such as murder to injury to no harm, and labels > > > > >> >> >> one end > > > > >> >> >> of the continuum evil. It then struggles with reconciling the > > > > >> >> >> continuum, or at least an end of it, with an omniscient God. > > > > >> >> >> What I proposed as a definition of evil proceeds from > > > > >> >> >> within, > > > > >> >> >> from the effect the evil has on those involved with it. Thus, I > > > > >> >> >> proposed that an evil act is one that drives us together, one > > > > >> >> >> that > > > > >> >> >> makes us desperate for the comfort of other human beings. > > > > >> >> >> Doing this I > > ... > > Erfahren Sie mehr » --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. 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