that is, indeed, the choice...
On Jul 23, 6:07 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote:
> For sure it is the fork in the road for us, but that is why we are not
> married and couldn't be locked in a room alone together for more that
> an hour and a half unless there was some mutual attraction accompanied
> by heavy breathing, however you did point out............
>
> >" It seems
> > to me that the more we look away from what makes us uncomfortable in
> > an effort to control our lives, the more what we find uncomfortable
> > comes into our experience in one way or another................mb
>
> But this is inconsistent with my personal world because my life is
> more than comfortable, while the only discomfort comes from the
> external. I pay more for gas/food/product and deal with war/pollution/
> usery because the external world continues to act in a way that is
> detrimental to the, as you put it "greatest good for all". Dream on
> my lovely friend!!
>
> I have a friend who thinks on your lines and performs, what I perceive
> as a perfunctory service, a prison ministry and constantly has to deal
> with car theft and vandalism which further leads to home burglary
> through the theft of mail she leaves in her car and the only thing I
> can think of when talking to her is "what are you trying to do?",
> "what are you doing?" and "Start living for your 'self 'and stop
> trying to change the idiots in the world". Meanwhile her success
> stories are people running around in parking lots handing out 4"x4"
> pieces of paper hailing Jesus as their savior while asking for
> donations to their cause. In all reality Jesus for them is a "get out
> of jail free card" and they know nothing, nothing at all about Jesus,
> the Bible, Spirituality or anything relevant to life beyond the
> mundane. This place is a joke for me and that is why I'm simply the
> voyeur.
>
> One thing I can say I am not is delusional.
>
> Just because I am here doesn't mean I have to be part of it.
>
> On Jul 23, 4:24 pm, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > This may very well be the point where we differ, Slip. I do not see
> > myself as separate from my shadow, the animal kingdom, you, anyone
> > else or any part of the vast experience called living. If I am
> > allowing the greatest good for all, I am allowing the greatest good
> > for my self, because all facets of my experience are of me, internal
> > and external. I don't think that we can barricade ourselves from the
> > external or the internal and find a comfortable level of integration,
> > although we may find a comfort zone for living for awhile. It seems
> > to me that the more we look away from what makes us uncomfortable in
> > an effort to control our lives, the more what we find uncomfortable
> > comes into our experience in one way or another, usually in ways that
> > are out of our control, like a shadow projection.
>
> > On Jul 23, 5:15 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > Well Molly, your "allowing the greatest good for all" part seems off
> > > my list. My approach appears to be more selfish than that. I
> > > expressed a disengagement from the external, not necessarily an
> > > indifference but a personal, self imposed division while maintaining a
> > > juxtaposition. Further, it is the animal correlation and the many
> > > facets of control exhibited by that kingdom. While we represent a
> > > distant part of it, we are nonetheless a part and that would have
> > > bearing upon your control issue. Your post seems to address Justin
> > > and Fran's interpretations and so I didn't see the imbued relevance to
> > > my post. Kill two birds with one stone, eh? I also found some
> > > significance in the Jung and Nietzsche reference to shadow and self in
> > > regards to control. The thread issue is very complex and will not
> > > find resolve in any one or several posts as each post may present a
> > > new aspect from which to view this perplexing mental characteristic of
> > > being in control.
> > > Considering further the issue of control, I would have to ask myself
> > > if I am really in control or do I focus on the cosmos in order to
> > > transfer the control over to some other universal energy that seems to
> > > work for me while at the same time thinking that I am in control or
> > > controlling a situation, morphing from the controller to the
> > > controlled in a metaphysical sense.
> > > I think you have started a great thread and also agree with Vam that
> > > we should eliminate the puppy dung and ornography and solidify the
> > > continuity of posts. These inappropriate and irrelevant intrusions
> > > only serve as an impediment to the already difficult path to analysis
> > > and perspective of the complex thread topic, they are an obstacle to
> > > productive philosophy.
> > > As an aside I think that irrelevant posts should simply be removed by
> > > the moderation squad before they even get the opportunity to waste our
> > > mental energy upon reading them. Why do they even appear?
>
> > > On Jul 23, 3:21 pm, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > I did see your good post, Slip, and found it interesting that we were
> > > > creating posts for this thread at about the same time. I thought,
> > > > after finishing my post and reading yours, that my comment
> > > > "participating in a way that demands our awareness and responses
> > > > allowing the greatest good for all. " covered what I would have said
> > > > to yours. Was there something else you wanted to delve into?
>
> > > > On Jul 23, 4:05 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > > Did you miss my 11:15 post, Molly?
>
> > > > > On Jul 23, 2:40 pm, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > I don't remember anyone implying that anger is a spirit...and Wes,
> > > > > > these are nice biblical references, but what is your point in citing
> > > > > > them?
>
> > > > > > On Jul 23, 1:52 pm, Wes <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > >Do we have the power to create our realities? Are we in control?
> > > > > > > >What do YOU think?
>
> > > > > > > 29. Jesus said, "If the flesh came into being because of spirit,
> > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > is a marvel, but if spirit came into being because of the body,
> > > > > > > that
> > > > > > > is a marvel of marvels. (The Gospel of
> > > > > > > Thomas)http://www.gnosis.org/naghamm/gosthom.html
>
> > > > > > > If Anger, or Greed, or Nicotine, or things like that are called
> > > > > > > spirits, then you could say that these things that control us are
> > > > > > > created by us. (Wine and Spirits ~ Alcoholism can take a pretty
> > > > > > > heavy
> > > > > > > handed control of a person. Prohibition was reversed, and
> > > > > > > (Creator-
> > > > > > > ed?) a new course for the country/world.)
>
> > > > > > > On Jul 22, 9:29 am, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > > Are we in control of ourselves, our lives, our families, our
> > > > > > > > worlds?
> > > > > > > > Or are we just aware and knowing what one can do if something
> > > > > > > > unpredictable happens?
> > > > > > > > There are many explanations for why we do what we do. For
> > > > > > > > example,
> > > > > > > > Thomas Metzinger's new Book, The Ego Tunnel: The Science of the
> > > > > > > > Mind
> > > > > > > > and the Myth of the Self, seriously questions whether there is
> > > > > > > > even an
> > > > > > > > "I", let alone a "we." And Douglas Hofstadter's book, I Am a
> > > > > > > > Strange
> > > > > > > > Loop, contends that the "self" is a recursively self-referencing
> > > > > > > > memory loop.
>
> > > > > > > > Hundreds of experiments by Benjamin Libet and others tend to
> > > > > > > > conclusively confirm that our brain prepares to execute our
> > > > > > > > decisions
> > > > > > > > before we are even aware that anything is being decided. It
> > > > > > > > alerts us
> > > > > > > > to our decisions only in time (a split second) for us to veto
> > > > > > > > them.
>
> > > > > > > > Seehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benjamin_Libet, as well as
> > > > > > > > Benjamin
> > > > > > > > Libet's book, Mind Time, and Walter J. Freeman's book, How
> > > > > > > > Brains Make
> > > > > > > > Up Their Minds.
>
> > > > > > > > It is quite likely that we have no so-called "free will" other
> > > > > > > > than
> > > > > > > > veto power over our specific actions. Our free will may consist
> > > > > > > > instead of 1) being mindful about any ill-serving subliminal
> > > > > > > > intentions and tendencies that inform our actions so that we are
> > > > > > > > accordingly prepared to veto any action that they
> > > > > > > > correspondingly
> > > > > > > > inform, and of 2) programming (or reprogramming) our subliminal
> > > > > > > > intentions to be more productive of the experiencing that we
> > > > > > > > most
> > > > > > > > desire.
>
> > > > > > > > Do we have the power to create our realities? Are we in
> > > > > > > > control?
> > > > > > > > What do YOU think?
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