On 25 Jan, 16:06, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > I, for one, welcome Pat's ideas and knowledge - all extensive. Like a > breath of fresh air in this group, as he extends the boundaries of > thinking with his kind treatment. >
Cheers, Molly!! > On Jan 22, 8:28 am, Pat <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > On 22 Jan, 11:51, Ian Pollard <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > 2010/1/22 Pat <[email protected]> > > > > > Then, to make an allegation that I'm an apostate, is, > > > > from a standpoint of an educated individual, an EXTREME position and > > > > one that you could never back up. > > > > You deny the existence of free will in the Bible: You're an apostate. > > > Nope. In order to be an apostate, one has, FIRST, to have > > accepted the premiss and THEN rejected it. I never DID accept it > > first, thus my refusal to EVER partake in the Eucharist/Communion > > based on my own moral standards (between ages 5-12). I realised that > > Christianity (Methodism), as it was presented to me, was misguided > > when I was seven years old (once I realised that Jesus was Jewish and > > those who supposedly follow him aren't). I, then, considered myself > > to be agnostic. Then, I went through a period where I considered > > myself to be atheistic, as I could find no evidence FOR God. Then I > > ran across St. Anselm's ontological argument, realised his subtle > > mistake in phrasing the argument, and realised that there must be a > > God. Then went back to look at various and sundry scriptures, > > teaching myself how to read Hebrew and Greek (I'm now learning Arabic) > > so that I didn't have to rely on translations. And have studied many > > non-Abrahamic scriptures as well. So, you're quite wrong about my > > apostasy. > > Nor have I ever denied the 'appearance' of free will in this world, > > rather, I account for it due to our lack of access to the future > > coupled with the ability to speculate in any given present. I can't > > help it if that illusion isn't seen as such by others...As the Qur'an > > says: "We (that's God using the royal 'we') guide those whom We will > > and leave astray those whom We will." I think you'll find there's > > little room for the usual view of free will in that statement. And it > > doesn't take an extremist to see that. > > > > > My agenda is the truth and the > > > > dispensation OF that. > > > > Can we have the old Pat back, please? I miss him. > > > The new Pat is no different than the old Pat; he just has stronger > > convictions in what he already held to be true (because I've > > discovered more evidence that backs it up)...and, isn't AS fearful of > > making statements that might upset a few people. Apologies if you're > > upset, but I stand by what I say. And I only say what I say because I > > feel it's time that humanity take on board the philosophical > > implications of certain scientific advances (Special Relativity, in > > this case) that have been known for almost a century now, and have > > been demonstrated empirically since then through time dilation. > > > > Ian- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en.
