I just read Vam's comments are right on,,  if I could have only one wish
for mankind that would be it. "Freedom from corruption".. (sigh;;  To dream
the impossible dream...)

It could be easy, but what can I say,,  that is not the idea or response of
the top men or at least that what they appear to avoid at all costs.
Allan


On Thu, Feb 2, 2012 at 5:33 PM, Vam <[email protected]> wrote:

> Freedom from corruption is actually the easiest of things to achieve.
> The top man needs to honest, fair, sincere, secure and sharing.
>
> On Feb 2, 6:39 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Much to agree with on what we might call fudge and mudge.  Things
> > certainly seem to have become much worse as the business model and its
> > people have moved in.  What I want to know more about is what
> > facilitates the corruption and, of course, what might bring it to an
> > end.  This should be a key issue in organisational design, but anti-
> > corruption becomes a self-serving bureaucracy in-itself, often
> > preventing the actual desired purpose.
> >
> > One of the naive issues ejucation is replete with is teaching the
> > right way to do things without reference to what goes on in actual
> > work situations and power-relations.  Many of us respond with some
> > distress to standard philosophical considerations where the argument
> > made is only possible because of what is excluded.  In business
> > ejucation this is referred to as the learning transfer problem - these
> > days no one dares to say the 'learning material' itself is a load of
> > tosh (shades of the worst of religion).  My mature students, always a
> > source of inspiration, have often said they enjoy being able to debate
> > critical concerns and that they hope I don't expect them to take this
> > into the workplace where this would be an effective job-suicide note.
> >
> > Whistle-blowers are now being paid off through compromise agreements
> > even in bodies responsible for supervising complaints and standards.
> > "Harmony" is a hair spray rigsy!  Not a bad metaphor for what gets
> > sprayed over the problems.  My feeling is the rotten orchard needs
> > something stronger.  The situation is 'Emperor's New Clothes', but I'm
> > afraid the child's voice ending and everything fine after that can't
> > work.
> >
> > I'm not concerned much on a personal basis, largely on what Molly
> > says.  I suspect the stuff of this corruption prevents almost all
> > practical argument and is what science excludes from its
> > considerations.
> >
> > On Feb 2, 12:32 pm, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > > Yes- it is about harmony- understanding it and finding it.
> >
> > > On Feb 2, 5:44 am, Molly <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > > I can see that my sense of morality has changed over the years along
> > > > with my relationship to life.  Yet at the core of it, is a sense of
> > > > self respect that allowed me to walk away from a couple of decent
> > > > incomes and destructive human relationships because of the culture of
> > > > war they brought with them.  Somehow, expressing truth in the moment
> > > > was never enough, the war raged on.  In retrospect, I can see that
> > > > what I was walking to when walking away was far better, but at the
> > > > time, the path was forming as my foot hit the exit doorway in the
> > > > walking away.  I've never been comfortable in that scenario, but I
> can
> > > > now see it has payed off for me in the long run.  It always starts
> > > > with listening to my gut.
> >
> > > > An interesting time we live in, with our education, political and
> > > > financial systems no longer serving us. With eyes blurred from Rome
> > > > burning, it is hard to see what is coming for us.  What I do know is
> > > > we are a resilient lot, and something will.  The education system
> does
> > > > suck, my youngest is still in University and has always struggled
> with
> > > > the system.  He will get his BA in May with honors, something he
> never
> > > > experienced in the younger grades.  Somehow, he made it work out of a
> > > > desire for a good life.
> >
> > > > Myself, I found a way to make it work while still doing my own thing
> > > > in the University, but after being told by the English Dept to find a
> > > > different course of study.  I was lucky that there was a more
> creative
> > > > "alternative" available or I would probably have quit.  I did see
> > > > (what seemed to me) the brightest teachers struggling with the
> > > > bureaucracy of their profession.  But it seems to me we all struggle
> > > > with that, even my husband, the Chiropractor, who is in practice by
> > > > himself.  If we live in community, we adapt to the rules, regs,
> norms,
> > > > laws, while expressing ourselves the best we can.  Seems to me that
> > > > finding a lasting harmony there is the real trick, no matter the
> > > > details of it.
> >
> > > > On Feb 1, 3:54 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > > > I had a sense of doing what seemed right as a cop Allan - even
> though
> > > > > most situations were difficult to see a right side in.  The academy
> > > > > stinks as in the State of Denmark and I get to feel the only thing
> is
> > > > > to retreat to the margins.  My working guess is that it's
> > > > > "meritocracy" that sucks.
> >
> > > > > On Feb 1, 8:30 pm, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > > > > > not being obnoxious, The that comes to my mind is just what is
> your
> > > > > > understanding of morality and how  it is applied in ones life.
> > > > > >  Understanding morality on a personal level can be quite
> difficult,
> > > > > > especially if you want it to make sense.
> > > > > > Allan
> >
> > > > > > On Wed, Feb 1, 2012 at 7:39 PM, archytas <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> > > > > > > I hope to spend the next 5 years "not teaching" - a difficult
> > > > > > > financial decision as this is my 'ready-to-hand' income.  Some
> years
> > > > > > > back I tried to take and stick to a decision not to teach
> 'ideological
> > > > > > > rot' - broadly the mainstream of business and economic
> subjects.  This
> > > > > > > might seem a fairly easy personal, moral decision; yet it
> isn't.
> >
> > > > > > > The interesting issues don't concern the easy morality of
> doing what's
> > > > > > > right.  One can find plenty of material, from Critical Theory
> through
> > > > > > > to deconstructive approaches to behaviour and critical
> psychology -
> > > > > > > and once, very critical management books like Peter Anthony's
> > > > > > > 'Foundation of Management' and sort programmes out on the
> basis of
> > > > > > > these.  Thus one could teach material one might feel credible
> and
> > > > > > > stretching, broadly aimed at students learning critical
> reasoning.  I
> > > > > > > do offer modules based around writers like David Graeber,
> Steve Keen
> > > > > > > and modern blogs at the moment.
> >
> > > > > > > What muddies the waters is a combination of streamlining costs
> in HE
> > > > > > > and more or less the extirpation of syllabus control by
> academics,
> > > > > > > along with a massive dilution of student brain-power and the
> > > > > > > connection of student success with the numbers we pass.    This
> > > > > > > situation makes moral judgement very difficult and academe has
> > > > > > > collapsed altogether as a moral place.
> >
> > > > > > > Economics has long been taught as a science - an utter farce -
> and
> > > > > > > management theories are only fit for ridicule (excellence,
> kwality and
> > > > > > > anything with 'strategic' in it).  The world works around
> power and
> > > > > > > rhetoric, and this is the only real content of such "theories".
> >
> > > > > > > The madness that underlies all this is that we never address
> what the
> > > > > > > real issues might be.  Accumulated wealth is clearly a problem
> for
> > > > > > > democracy as it inevitably means some will benefit by doing
> nothing
> > > > > > > while others work and that the wealth will be used to influence
> > > > > > > politics and the very ground of commercial competition.  Yet
> with no
> > > > > > > consideration of this we leap into "theorising" in a system
> that
> > > > > > > applauds the creation of excess wealth in few hands as a
> 'good'.
> >
> > > > > > > One can try to teach what one believes is true and in simple
> morality
> > > > > > > this is what one ought to do.  The actual situation is much
> more
> > > > > > > complex.  The jobs available in teaching (apart from a few
> little
> > > > > > > eddies I have occupied) are nearly all to do with teaching the
> rot,
> > > > > > > because this is the cheapest way universities can devise.  The
> moral
> > > > > > > choice of not teaching rot changes to a choice not to teach
> (and get
> > > > > > > paid) - partly because your own students will be examined on
> the rot
> > > > > > > because you are teaching as part of a 'team' and all students
> are set
> > > > > > > the same questions as part of standardisation.  If you don't
> teach the
> > > > > > > muck you put your students at a disadvantage.
> >
> > > > > > > I see no answers to the moral conundrum - other than just to
> walk
> > > > > > > away, putting distance between oneself and the madness.
> >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > >  (
> > > > > >   )
> > > > > > |_D Allan
> >
> > > > > > Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.- Hide quoted
> text -
> >
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>



-- 
 (
  )
|_D Allan

Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living.

Reply via email to