it's this time of year again?
On Wed, Dec 25, 2013 at 7:31 AM, Aaron Newton <[email protected]> wrote: > It being Xmas eve and in theory a time for a spirit of cheer (regardless > of your religious affiliations or lack there of), I'm going to step in and > briefly attempt to be a voice of reason on this thread. > > 1) J Dalton isn't exactly a nobody > (ahem<https://www.google.com/search?q=john+david+dalton>, > and ahem <https://github.com/jdalton>) and in the circles of those of us > who have been around here for a while he caries a certain amount of > gravitas, respect, and shall we say chutzpah. He's paid a lot of dues and, > even if his posts here are a bit antagonistic, the man knows of what he > speaks. > > 2) When he says that the decline of MooTools is entirely because of the > core devs and no one else he is mostly correct. This is to say that > MooTools was the brainchild of one particular developer who focused all his > energy on code quality and not, for example, the community that used it. > The core team grew around this kind of mentality which is why MooTools has > excellent code with a community that did not grow as well as jQuery's. > jQuery was designed in many ways to be accessible to everyone, programmers > and non-programmers, which inherently makes its audience much larger than > MooTools which requires that you actually know (or learn) what the hell > you're doing. The long-term effect of this is that as the core dev team > grew up, got married, got pinched by Facebook and others, they had less > time for Moo. This is true of jQuery, too, but because they put their > community first and opened anyone who wanted to help with open arms (where > to become a committer for MooTools you basically had to want it more than > anything in life), it meant that jQuery has an ever revolving door of new > talent picking up where the old guard left off. > > So when you lament that jQuery sucks and MooTools is better remember that > with software, and open source software in particular, generating interest, > commitment, and most of all empowering your users is more important in > "winning" than writing good code. MooTools got that backwards and is where > it is because of it. > > When J Dalton says that rather than complaining about it you can instead "try > contributing to MooTools or jQuery to make them better" he is precisely > correct. There is only one way for MooTools to become relevant today and > that is for someone with talent and passion to pick it up, dust it off a > little, and grow a community around it. > > But complaining about here isn't going to solve any problems. Not that the > sentiment isn't felt in the hearts of everyone else on the list and, I > suppose, the catharsis alone might feel invigorating. > > -aaron > > P.S. J Dalton, please don't call people here trolls. Even if you think > they are, hell, even if they *actually* are, calling someone a troll just > makes things worse. You should know better. > > Happy Holidays! > > > On Tue, Dec 24, 2013 at 10:03 PM, Sanford Whiteman <[email protected]>wrote: > >> > I've been around before you and will be around long after you lose >> > interest in going tit for tat in this mailing thread. >> >> I'll grant that you can sustain your present level of service to the >> MooTools user community for a very long time: I see a grand total of >> one (1) message from you to this list from 2009-2012. Keep up the good >> lurk! >> >> And I see now that you work for Microsoft! (Did you think I knew that >> and was "trolling" you knowing you would ride for them no matter >> what?) Your reactions sounded off-kilter before, but now they make >> sense. You work for the major player that started bundling jQuery in >> 2008 and hired a jQuery hero as an "evangelist" in 2009 -- well before >> anyone could say MooTools fell behind -- so of course you'd want to >> publicly frame those actions as merely reactive, rather than shrewd >> moves and later market drivers. That the owners of the MooTools code >> are 100.00% to blame and *no other factor other than mismanagement* >> came into play rings of the extreme positions you hear in antitrust >> suits. [Don't bother, I'll fill in your denial myself.] >> >> Anyway, congrats on the win. Nothing for you to defend here, just a >> bunch of losers carrying a torch. >> >> -- S. >> >> -- >> >> --- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MooTools Users" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> > > -- > > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MooTools Users" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. > -- Erik Cervin-Edin +33 (0)6 25 58 89 97 Erik.CervinEd.in -- --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MooTools Users" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. 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