there are probably some Peter, but in that area comics are king as I
think today 90% of comics above $1000 are bought by investors and not
true collectors
At 04:01 PM 9/27/2009, P Molitor wrote:
Are there really "speculators" a la comeeks? That's a serious
question, as I honestly don't know and am curious. I do know that a
lot of the high prices paid for UniHo and other rare posters ("Baby
Face", "Citizen Kane" style B, etc.) seem to go to folks that
genuinely love the movies and seem ready to acknowledge the rarity
of the items with hefty prices, (curse their well-to-do hides).
Are there really Wall Street @-holes out there buying posters as
"investments"?
--Peter
--- On Sun, 9/27/09, James Richard <[email protected]> wrote:
From: James Richard <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [MOPO] Subject: Re:THE SLOW DESTRUCTION OF OUR HOBBY
and OUR PART IN IT
To: [email protected]
Date: Sunday, September 27, 2009, 1:44 PM
Rick,
"Otherwise, we ourselves will be an INTREGAL PART of turning Movie
Poster Collecting EVEN ON IT'S HIGHEST LEVEL into a BUYER's
MARKET. If the day comes when you can buy an authentic, original
CASABLANCA US 1-Sheet for $7500 or an original FRANKENSTEIN US
1-Sheet for $75,000, our hobby will truly be in desperate straits."
Spoken like a true seller. I think there are a whole lot of
collectors out there who would totally disagree that a "buyer's
market" in movie posters would be a bad thing.
For starters, any such "fear deflation" would not spread to the
whole business, not without very good reason (like a bunch of
convincing fakes turning up in the $4,000 to $8,000 range). It would
start at the very top, where prices are already absurd even compared
to 10 years ago and now limited to purchase by the very wealthy. I
don't consider that situation "good for the hobby" at all. Quite the
opposite: Look at what happened to comic book collecting when that
happened. But anyway, it would be the very high end that was most
affected by Fear and Loathing in Posterville and I'm not going to
weep for speculators if the posters they paid too much for is
suddenly worth a bit less than they were 4 years ago. They have to
take their lumps in the speculative marketplace just like they do in
the stock market or the real estate market. As for genuine
collectors who have owned their rare Universal Horror Stuff for a
decade or more... well, they paid a lot less for those posters than
current prices so if the market price drops some they are still
ahead of the game.
Now if convincing fakes are discovered in the under-$10,000 range
then, yes, there would be some deflation there as well, but there
should be if such convincing fakes are discovered. Why should buyers
continue to spend large sums of money without some believable
assurance that they aren't being had -- either knowingly or
unknowingly by the seller?
The selling and restoration communities (who are the "industry" part
of this hobby-industry) are now going to circle the wagons and try
to convince all of us circling buyer-Indians that there is no real
cause for alarm and that we should all continue to go on paying
ever-increasing prices for the desirable pieces year after year.
Phooey. As sellers were so fond of saying during the Big Price Run
Up, "it's the market that sets the price". OK, so let's go with that
-- or is does that maxim only apply when the market is constantly rising?
If Greed is Good, then logically Deflation is Good as well --
because it allows people to indulge their greed by getting more for
their money.
I think it is very inaccurate to describe concerned collectors who
are trying to get to the bottom of this problem -- and then actually
*do something* about it (which never was done in the past when fakes
were discovered) -- as people pouring gasoline on the flames.
Knowledge is not gasoline and Truth is not flames.
-- JR
<http://us.mc315.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]>[email protected]
wrote:
I think that any collector or dealing who's looking to buy or bid
on a high-end poster or lobby card should be CAUTIOUSLY CONCERNED
before proceeding with his possible acquisition, but I can see the
lever of PARANOIA and FEAR reaching some kind of a fever pitch
soon...and I this 99% of it is UNWARRANTED.
This Universal Horror forgery situation was like the PERFECT
STORM...you bring together one collector fairly new to the hobby
(since 2001, I think the article said). who allegedly joins forces
with one of the most brilliant restorers in the hobby---the specter
of GREED enters into the equation and...PRESTO...a few months or a
couple years later you have a two million dollar forgery plan that
ultimately FAILED. But in order for it to ever happen, the
linchpin in this whole scenario (or any scenario like it) is THE RESTORER.
The fact of the matter is that there are VERY FEW restorers out
there who can do the INCREDIBLE things that our Alleged Universal
Horror Forgery Restorer can do.
Hey, these guys have been virtually PAINTING IN GREAT BIG
MISSING PIECES of movie posters for 15 years or more...this
practice is NOTHING NEW. On the other hand, creating an ENTIRE
poster IS something new. But I don't think there are THAT MANY
RESORERS out there who are CAPABLE of pulling something like this off.
Sure, I think we should have some entity in the hobby who
examines high end pieces and certifies that they're
authentic. But with all this FEAR and PARANOIA out there, if I
had the funds available, I'd have my sights on that CREATURE
1-Sheet that's presently only at $3300. Hell, the way I see it
this is the PERFECT TIME for some 50's Sci-Fi collector out there
to get an original Creature From The Black Lagoon
US 1-Sheet for, who knows...maybe UNDER $10,000!!
I think we as seasoned collectors and dealers have a
RESPONSIBILITY not to EMPTY A CAN OF GASOLINE on the gathering
flames of FEAR and PARANOIA. Otherwise, we ourselves will be an
INTREGAL PART of turning Movie Poster Collecting EVEN ON IT'S
HIGHEST LEVEL into a BUYER's MARKET. If the day comes when you
can buy an authentic, original CASABLANCA US 1-Sheet for $7500 or
an original FRANKENSTEIN US 1-Sheet for $75,000, our hobby will
truly be in desperate straits.
This kind of Buyer's Market, might be "good" for the Collector, but
it's definitely BAD FOR THE HOBBY and the HOBBY'S FUTURE. I think
whether it's GLENN BECK or a member poster on MoPo---spewing out
utterances of FEAR and PARANOIA are an effective way to make people
TOTALLY SCARED SHITLESS
when maybe they should be CAUTIOUS + CONCERNED---wanting to EXAMINE
ALL OF THE FACTS instead of frantically clutching on to the
terrifying SOUND BITES. Hey, I thin we SHOULD be concerned about
what's going on...VERY CONCERNED. But I also think that if I had a
few extra bucks, I'd email the seller who has the CREATURE 1Sheet
up on eBay...ask some questions, perform as thorough investigation
as I could---and WIN THAT $20,000 one sheet for 1/2 WHAT IT'S WORTH!
The point I'm trying to make is that we need to be a part of the
SOLUTION, not a part of the PROBLEM.
If we all join in and take the TERROR LEVEL up to RED when maybe it
should be on YELLOW---we're consciously or unconsciously throwing
fuel on the fire that eventually could lead to "THE DESTRUCTION OF
OUR HOBBY"....
Rick Ryan
Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com
___________________________________________________________________
How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List
Send a message addressed to: [email protected]
In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L
The author of this message is solely responsible for its content.
Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com
___________________________________________________________________
How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List
Send a message addressed to: [email protected]
In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L
The author of this message is solely responsible for its content.
Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com
___________________________________________________________________
How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List
Send a message addressed to: [email protected]
In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L
The author of this message is solely responsible for its content.
