That's where I would disagree - by deliberately setting a self fulfilling tautology as the definition:
Thing occurs because of motive, the motive is to be better, the thing that occurred was better. Sounds stupid and is, but its the same as saying "things happened becuase they were predisposed to happen", which is synonymous with "things happened because probability favoured it", which begins to sound less stupid. When I then talk about the lack of independence between a thing and the wider pattern in which it resides, and its the predisposition of the whole system which favours a set of events involving the subject, it begins to sound positively sensible. Where given "improvements" are considered to be made within the defined subset moral codes of each observer defined set, I have of course lost all real sense of what it means to improve something, but have sucessfully (albeit badly) defined betterness. I'ts complete doublethink, but IMO a delusion of high quality. > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of MarshaV > Sent: 24 July 2007 10:59 > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [Moq_Discuss] [MD] Aristotle & DQ > > > At 05:44 AM 7/24/2007, you wrote: > >Fair point, > >but even the words "dynamic" and "quality" are assumptions overlaid > >on that essential source. > > And so also "worth, or merit, or value, or betterness or any of the > other synonyms for good." > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf > Of MarshaV > > > Sent: 24 July 2007 10:41 > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Subject: Re: [Moq_Discuss] [MD] Aristotle & DQ > > > > > > > > > > > > From, 'A brief summary of the Metaphysics of Quality' > > > by Robert Pirsig October 2005 > > > > > > "The Metaphysics of Quality, or MOQ, is simply a > philosophic answer > > > to the question of what is Quality, or worth, or merit, > or value, or > > > betterness or any of the other synonyms for good. There are many > > > possible answers but the one the MOQ gives is that you > can understand > > > Quality best if you don't subordinate it to anything > else but instead > > > subordinate everything else to it. > > > > > > It says there are two basic kinds of Quality, an > undefined Quality > > > called Dynamic Quality, and a defined quality called > static quality. > > > Static quality is further divided into four evolutionary > divisions: > > > inorganic, biological, social and intellectual. Our entire > > > understanding of the world can be organized within this > framework. > > > When you do so things fall into place that were poorly defined > > > before, and new things appear that were concealed under previous > > > frameworks of understanding. The MOQ is not intended to > deny previous > > > modes of understanding as much as to expand them into a more > > > inclusive picture of what it's all about. > > > > > > The "Quality" of the Metaphysics of Quality is not a > basic substance, > > > or anything like it. The Buddhists call it "nothingness" > precisely to > > > avoid that kind of intellectual characterization. Once > you start to > > > define Quality as a basic substance you are off on a completely > > > different path from the MOQ." > > > > > > http://robertpirsig.org/MOQSummary.htm > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > > > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > > > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > > > Archives: > > > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > > > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > > > > > > This email was received from the INTERNET and scanned by the > > > Government Secure Intranet Anti-Virus service supplied by > > > Cable&Wireless in partnership with MessageLabs. (CCTM > > > Certificate Number 2006/04/0007.) 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