[Platt] As for those who may think Pirsig doesn't acknowledge the existence and importance of the individual (self)...
[Arlo] Not this talk-radio crap again. We had been doing so well... [Platt] ... the following from ZAMM should prove of interest: [Arlo] I wholeheartedly agree with Pirsig, we do need to return to encouraging individual excellence, integrity and worth. I took a look at the totality of ZMM's sentiments back in 2006, and wrote a short bit on what we can consider to be this "individual excellence" Pirsig was getting at. I copied it below for those who did not see it before. We also have to consider that Pirsig begins by saying this "Phaedrus went a different path from the idea of individual, personal Quality decisions. I think it was a wrong one...", but yet we know that Pirsig does not think it was a wrong one at all, as Phaedrus' path is truly Pirsig's path. We see Pirsig describing Phaedrus' path as "the solution started with a new philosophy, or he saw it as even broader than that...a new spiritual rationality...in which the ugliness and the loneliness and the spiritual blankness of dualistic technological reason would become illogical. Reason was no longer to be "value free." Reason was to be subordinate, logically, to Quality..." Its quite evident that Phaedrus' "wrong path" is not "wrong at all" but the path that Pirsig ends at with the formulation of the MOQ. And, we should also take ZMM in full, and recall that the root problem for Pirsig was that "Reason and Quality had become separated and in conflict with each other and Quality had been forced under and reason made supreme somewhere back then [Ancient Greece]". (ZMM) And, this is important, the "lack of individual worth" he laments in this passage is a fallout from the mass production era that removed "artisanship" from labor. He writes, in ZMM, "[Individuals] are sustained by structural relationships even when they have lost all other meaning and purpose. People arrive at a factory and perform a totally meaningless task from eight to five without question because the structure demands that it be that way. There's no villain, no "mean guy" who wants them to live meaningless lives, it's just that the structure, the system demands it and no one is willing to take on the formidable task of changing the structure just because it is meaningless." (ZMM) He sums up this alienation in the following way. "Along the streets that lead away from the apartment he can never see anything through the concrete and brick and neon but he knows that buried within it are grotesque, twisted souls forever trying the manners that will convince themselves they possess Quality, learning strange poses of style and glamour vended by dream magazines and other mass media, and paid for by the vendors of substance. He thinks of them at night alone with their advertised glamorous shoes and stockings and underclothes off, staring through the sooty windows at the grotesque shells revealed beyond them, when the poses weaken and the truth creeps in, the only truth that exists here, crying to heaven, God, there is nothing here but dead neon and cement and brick." (ZMM) So by all means, let's consider the totality of ZMM, of what Pirsig was saying there. Let's not only consider the value of "individual worth" but why Pirsig felt this value had been "depleted". =========== In ZMM, Pirsig addresses this point [individual excellence] many times. For example, he says... "I like the word "gumption" because its so homely and so forlorn and so out of style it looks as if it needs a friend and isnt likely to reject anyone who comes along. Its an old Scottish word, once used a lot by pioneers, but which, like "kin," seems to have all but dropped out of use. I like it also because it describes exactly what happens to someone who connects with Quality. He gets filled with gumption. The Greeks called it enthousiasmos, the root of "enthusiasm." which means literally "filled with theos," or God, or Quality. See how that fits? A person filled with gumption doesnt sit around dissipating and stewing about things. Hes at the front of the train of his own awareness, watching to see whats up the track and meeting it when it comes. Thats gumption." Okay. About "gumption", Pirsig noted two types of traps that drain it away, "set backs" and "hang ups". Let's step away from set backs, and focus on hang up. Mainly because I think by examing the characterists that create "hang ups", and drain gumption, we can posit that the reverse of these would be someone "in touch with Quality". The first is "value rigidity". Someone trapped by this is not able to respond to Quality, so I'd posit that "value flexibility" is an important characteristic of a "Quality principled person". The next is "ego", also a frequent cause of "value rigidity". Hence I'd posit that "egolessness" or "modesty" is another characteristic of the "Quality principled person". Next, "anxiety" or fear of failure. Since this is the opposite of "ego" (in the gumption traps), I'd again posit that "egolessness" is again the Quality antonymic pole. Next, "boredom". Hence I'd say (with Pirsig) that the characteristic opposite this is having a "beginners mind". "Impatience" comes next, so I'd posit "patience" would indeed be a characteristic of the "Quality principled person". So far, then, we have the "Quality principled person" as one who is filled with gumption, posseses value flexibility, is egoless, has a beginner's mind and is patient. Also, as I posted many times, Pirsig's description of arete, as someone who is in touch with Quality BEFORE S/O dualism breaks that attachment, goes as such. "Thus the hero of the Odyssey is a great fighter, a wily schemer, a ready speaker, a man of stout heart and broad wisdom who knows that he must endure without too much complaining what the gods send; and he can both build and sail a boat, drive a furrow as straight as anyone, beat a young braggart at throwing the discus, challenge the Pheacian youthat boxing, wrestling or running; flay, skin, cut up and cook an ox, and be moved to tears by a song. He is in fact an excellent all-rounder; he has surpassing areté. Areté implies a respect for the wholeness or oneness of life, and a consequent dislike of specialization. It implies a contempt for efficiency...or rather a much higher idea of efficiency, an efficiency which exists not in one department of life but in life itself." So we add to our original list of "characteristics of the Quality principled person" and come up with the following. A "Quality principled person" is someone who respects the oneness of life. S/he is patient, egoless and possesses a "beginner's mind". S/he holds her values flexibley, and can be seen as filled with gumption. S/he dislikes specialization, and is an excellect all-arounder. But we can go somewhat further. Consider Pirsig's discussion of the wall in Korea. "It was beautiful because the people who worked on it had a way of looking at things that made them do it right unselfconsciously. They didnt separate themselves from the work in such a way as to do it wrong. There is the center of the whole solution." The aforementioned description is evidence in the craft of the individual. As the welder who did beautiful work on Pirsig's chain guard. So let's then consider this final description. A "Quality principled person" is someone who respects the oneness of life. S/he is patient, egoless and possesses a "beginner's mind". S/he holds her values flexibley, and can be seen as filled with gumption. S/he dislikes specialization, and is an excellect all-arounder. In her/his work, she demonstrates no division between art and practice, and her/his work can be seen as possessing beauty because of their unselfconscious way of looking at things. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
