Ron
On 12 May you wrote:
> What I am missing is a coherent argument from you about SOL. Which you
> seem unable to produce. So far you base it all on Some sort of
> bastardized Frankenstein monster version of Pirsigs MoQ supporting SOM
> and solving by redefining, which dresses to Impress but fails on the
> dance floor. It supplies nothing new. So humor me Bodivar, just this
> last time. Lets go over this one more time, Your central contention is
> that S/O distinction arises out of experience. That the intellectual
> level is a logical philosophy Based on this experience through "logical
> channels". You state that "logic" is pre-existent to intellect. Animals
> can perform it. Logic is inherent in nature.
Bo:
It's a short way from Capitol to the .??...cliffs as the Romans said,
what have I done to deserve this? The SOL is now so firmly
underpinned that the only alternatives are ignore me (Matt) or just
shout incoherent "no no" without any MOQ backing or
understanding. I doubt if you are capable of concentrating long
enough to listen through the full version, but look to this for Ian.
Ron:
The reason Matt will not converse with you is because you resort to
Leveling tactics as soon as the argument turns against you, you
Resort to belittling rhetoric instead of supplying a coherent
Stance of your ideas, much like you are doing right now.
You write me off so that you will not have to supply
A rational argument for your SOL case. Nicely done.
The fact is I am beating the shit out of you with MoQ
Understanding, and you can't stand it.
--------------
Bo:
Do you agree that the intellectual level is the fulcrum? If Pirsig
had treated it as SOM - not as if the villainous cuckoo "science"
had laid its S/O egg in its nest, then the SOL would have been
the one and only interpretation? Now, in the Paul Turner letter
Pirsig comes one hair's breadth from admitting that the 4th. level
is SOM.
I think the same happens to the term, "intellectual," when
one extends it much before the Ancient Greeks.*
".. the same" is the absurdity of making the social level disappear
into molecules, cells and atoms, and "the ancient Greeks" is
SOM in moqtalk. So here we have it from Pirsig for those who
think I commit a "lèse majesty".
------------------------
See Ron, Pirsig comes as close as his pride permits to affirming
the SOL, what more do you need?
Ron:
YOU want to see him affirming SOL so you look for it.
Pirsig is saying that Objective logic is the foundation of
Our societies intellectual level. We base our legal system,
Science, and engineering on it. Our whole social/intellectual
Understanding Is based in objective argument. Whether or not
You see Pirsig affiming SOL is beside the point. The fact is
Bo, it just doesn't work without throwing out half the MoQ.
In fact it just redefines objectivism.
Ron prev:
> Since S/O distinction arises out of experience This duality must exist
> in some form in reality.
"... out of experience"??? SOM is "out of society". As said to Ian
Pirsig presents science as a S/O cuckoo that has taken over the
intellectual level.This is not right: science is an intellectual pattern
because the S/O distinction is intellects VALUE. This is the only
way to cut the Gordian Knot that LILA tied the MOQ into and for it
to wield its enormous power.
Ron:
I Quote Bo Skutvik
"Thinking" in the intelligence sense has been with the Q-evolution since the
biological neural network facilitated storing of experience, its retrieval and
manipulation along logical "gates".
The Greeks began using intelligence along the S/O pattern because "philosophy"
necessarily is a search for objective truth,"
Once again,
Please explain HOW MoQ weilds this enormous power via the SOLution.
And it would settle this discussion rather quickly. Instead of asking
Someone else to do it for you and belittling every honest question
Put to you. If it is that simple and that powerful it should be
Real easy for you to explain in a short paragraph. I explained
Why I feel it fails, please explain why you feel it succeeds.
Any evasive tactic after this request is going to be viewed as
A recognition of SOL's failure. Not by just me but the majority of
The discuss.
Thank you for your time.
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