[Ian} > Nice try Bo, but getting desperate if you need Platt's defence and you > need to start accusing those you are debating with of simply being > "faithful" ... I'd be careful with the personal insults if I were you, > I was still trying to help.
Ian begins with a personal insult. Then warns Bo to "be careful" with personal insults. Flagrant hypocrisy. > So to dismiss Platt's defence. > > Pirsig does not say "the intellectal level" > He says "this intellectual level" Blatantly false. Here's the quote again. "What had happened since the end of World War I was that THE INTELLECTUAL LEVEL had entered the picture and had taken over everything It was this intellectual level that was screwing everything up." (Emphasis added) > Referring to the state of the predominant pattern (SOM) in the > intellectual level post WW2 (absolutely explicitly). Show us the "explicit" evidence you claim. Otherwise, puffs of wind. (Start by correcting "post WW2" to WW1.) > Just the usual despicable "Platteral shift" going on. Another personal insult. > Don't get drawn into the dirty tricks Bo, you're above that. Another personal insult. > Apology in order for calling me an animal too ;-) > How about it Bo ? > Ian Apology in order for three personal insults. How about it, Ian? Platt > On Wed, Nov 26, 2008 at 9:59 AM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Platt, Steve, Horse and the whole menagerie. > > > > 25 Nov. > > > > Steve had said: > >> > Let's be clear, the MOQ does not make SOM the intellectual level. > >> > Only the unnecessary and wrong-headed SOLAQI interpretation does > >> > this. The intellectual level of Pirsig's MOQ is the collection of > >> > all intellectual patterns of value. > > > >> In Lila Pirsig wrote: > > > >> "What had happened since the end of World War I was that the > >> intellectual level had entered the picture and had taken over > >> everything. It was this intellectual level that was screwing > >> everything up." > > > >> Doesn't look to me like a "collection of all intellectual patterns of > >> value" is doing the screwing. Rather it seems clear that Pirsig > >> identifies the intellectual level with amoral SOM -- the modern > trance > >> state. > > > >> I would go so far as to say that unless the intellectual level is > >> acknowledged to be the same as SOM, Pirsig's entire analysis of our > >> societal problems and his proposed MOQ solution goes down the toilet. > > > >> Then what have a got? Not much of value other than the fun of > >> philosophical debate. Maybe that's all we should expect, but I was > >> hoping for more. > > > > Wow, Platt's matter-of-fact style does much better than my shouthing > > from mountains. I respect Steve's and Horse's defending the Faith, but > > Pirsig is about as vague as Jesus and as this quote shows he does > > regard the intellectual level as SOM ... except when asked directly > > when it again turns into "intellectual patterns" and the circle is > closed. > > > > Nuff said > > > > Bo Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
