Ron,
Small point of thought...
You stated that :
"Remember slavery was abolished about 150 yrs
ago in the U.S. and civil rights in the last 50, I would
think it would be difficult break from subcultural values
of anti-establishment after hundreds of years of
development."
Remember, that abolition was merely of the legal
institution of slavery. Some estimate the
number of 'effective slaves' at nearly the same or
even higher numbers than what existed in pre-
abolition America. I have just started researching
it for a story, and I admit to some skepticism, as
to specific numbers, but not to the reality of this
sordid underground. (mostly non-black, now)
Secondly, although on paper the civil rights era
began big-time in the 1950's the true fruit is only
a couple or so decades old, when the majority
of African-American/Black/Negro (depending on the
generational terminology over those years) left
their traditional position of monolithic-economic-
underclass and moved into the middle class.
Rocketed upward, really...the dynamics of economy.
As to MoQ providing a 'fix', I am a bit skeptical.
Not of its power as a major shift in point of view,
but of the ability to transmit it, educate, and spread
it among a society committed to status quo. It'll
take two or three generations at least.
Practically speaking,
How do we get folks to: read the books?
understand the content?
act on it?
engage in appropriate realignment of sensibilities?
(a few dozen folks on this forum can't seem to agree)
thanks--mel
----- Original Message -----
From: "X Acto" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 7:49 AM
Subject: Re: [MD] Multiculturalism scam
Hello Platt,
A very thoughtful post . However I ask, how are we to make the distinction
from "an excuse for oppression through fear (central planning enforced at
the point of a gun)."?
How do we instill pro-social ethic without oppressing the individual?
I think we can not expect to fix this problem quickly because it evolved
over a long period of time. America allowed a culture of oppression to
develop
a culture in opposition to "the man" (central planning enforced at the point
of a gun).
Even today I hear older whites reffering to blacks who conform to social
standards
as a "good nigger".
Remember slavery was abolished about 150 yrs ago in the U.S. and civil
rights
in the last 50, I would think it would be difficult break from subcultural
values
of anti-establishment after hundreds of years of development. If you do
conform you are called an "uncle Tom" by your peers.
Yes the charge of racism is abused but most black people I
know see this as justified in defense of the more general racist atitudes
of white america.
I think it is idealistic to think that the MoQ would provide a quick fix
to these problems developed over centuries. If anything MoQ
helps us to realize that the fix requires changes in values and attitudes
over long periods of time from all parties.
-Ron
________________________________
From: Platt Holden <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Sent: Tuesday, January 6, 2009 7:23:50 AM
Subject: Re: [MD] Multiculturalism scam
All:
Pirsig pretty well pinpointed the problem with the multiculturism in
recounting his conversation with a professor at the University of Chicago:
"Phaedrus remembered a conversation in the early sixties with a University
of Chicago faculty member who was moving out of the Woodlawn neighborhood
next to the university. He was moving because criminal blacks had moved in
and it had become too dangerous to live there. Phaedrus had said he didn't
think moving out was any solution.
"The professor had blown up at him. "What you don't know!" he had said.
"We've tried everything! We've tried workshops, study groups, councils.
We've spent years in this. If there's anything we've missed we don't know
what it is. Everything has failed."
"The professor added, "You don't understand what a defeat this has been for
us. It's as though we never even tried."
"Phaedrus had had no answer at the time, but he had one now. The idea that
biological crimes can be ended by intellect alone, that you can talk crime
to death, doesn't work. Intellectual patterns cannot directly control
biological patterns. Only social patterns can control biological patterns,
and the instrument of conversation between society and biology is not
words. The instrument of conversation between society and biology has
always been a policeman or a soldier and his gun. All the laws of history,
all the arguments, all the Constitutions and the Bills of Rights and
Declarations of Independence are nothing more than instructions to the
military and police. If the military and police can't or don't follow these
instructions properly they might as well have never been written.
"Phaedrus now thought that part of the professors paralysis was a
commitment to the twentieth-century intellectual doctrines, in which his
university has had a prominent role. (Multiculturism) A second part of the
paralysis probably came from the fact that the criminals were black. If it
had been a group of trash whites moving into the neighborhood, robbing and
raping and killing, the response would have been much fiercer, but when
whites denounced blacks for robbing and raping and killing they left
themselves open to the charge of racism. In the atmosphere of public
opinion of that time no intellectual dared to open himself to the charge of
being a racist. Just the thought of it shut him up tight. Paralysis.
"That charge is part of the paralysis of this city here. Right now." (Lila,
24 -- Parens added.
Similar charges are flung today at anyone who challenges leftist doctrines,
as some recent posts on this site amply illustrate.
Platt
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