Mary said to Steve:
We have no argument at all. I reject Sam Harris' definition of an atheist.
Sounds like he's just trying to get into theist's face with it. Pick a fight.
As long as my liberties are not violated, I support the right of others to
believe things I do not. That's only fair.
Sam Harris said in his Atheist Manifesto: "The atheist is merely a person who
believes that the...[people] who claim to never doubt the existence of God
should be obliged to present evidence for his existence..."
dmb says:
Yes, Sam Harris is getting in their face and picking a fight. I love Sam
Harris. We need Sam Harris. If it were just a matter of letting people have
their secret beliefs, all tucked away from the world deep in their hearts, we
wouldn't even be talking about this. Isn't it just a bit disingenuous to
pretend that there's ISN'T a war on? I don't just mean foreign Islamic
militants but also the fundamentalists here at home.
You know what Sarah Palin means when she refers to "real" Americans, don't you?
She mean theists. That whole tea party thing too. Just try to find an atheist
in that crowd. Bet you a buck you can't find one. That pro-life dude who killed
the abortion doctor was just found guilty and sentenced the other day. The
doctors not yet killed by these guys are feeling mighty nervous. One up the
road from us has been forced to hire private security guards cause his whole
family has been issued a death threat. This has been going on since abortion
was legalized decades ago. Theism drives the republican party now more than
ever and they controlled all three branches of government for eight of the last
nine years. This brand of theopolitics goes back to Reagan, at least. This war
has been going as long as I can remember. I used to sit in church as a boy and
listen to the story of how they going to bring this nation back to god. Well,
looks like that wasn't just hot air. It is a mighty, mi
ghty, well funded and highly organized long term effort, the signs of which
can be seen in any newspaper on any day of the week. Isn't it impossible to
pretend that this is not a matter of public concern? This hypothetical theists
who never acts on his or her belief is pure fiction. Or so it seems to me.
I think Sam's point is valid. He points out that we have this strange custom in
our society wherein all our normal standards of reasonableness are abandoned
when it comes to religious beliefs. You can challenge a guy and call him crazy
for using a putter in the sand trap but if he cuts off the tip of his son's
penis because he thinks god likes things that way we don't say a word about it.
That's just weird. Sam is just saying that we should be consistent, that giving
religion a free pass or abandoning the standards of reasonableness is hurting
us. And who knows, maybe religion would rise to the challenge and get itself
straightened out.
I heard an especially creepy story the other day. Apparently, several
Congressmen have been helping a Nigerian politician pass a law in Nigeria that
will impose the death penalty on gay people just for being gay. These Americans
are conservative, christian, republicans who belong to a quasi-secret group
that's been operating in the nation's capital for decades. They're like some
kind of christian mafia. These are the same folks who are behind the national
prayer breakfast, which has always been a little slap in the face of
church-state separation. I realize this sounds like a wacky conspiracy theory
but I just checked and Wiki has a page about it. Didn't read it, just checked
to see if there was one. There's a big fat book out about them titled "The
Family".
This is just stuff I picked up without trying, you know. I'm not looking for
dirt on theists, it's just there in the news. It's just in my face. Have you
not heard about this stuff? You just don't think it's a problem? I'm not saying
we should panic, but it does seem wrong to be unconcerned. Am I the only one
who see it that way?
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail: Trusted email with powerful SPAM protection.
http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/201469227/direct/01/
Moq_Discuss mailing list
Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.
http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org
Archives:
http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/
http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
