Marsha, I agree completely that self and object have no autonomous existence.
> > And John, I prefer to use no-thingness, or better yet: emptiness, rather > than > nothingness. Self and objects are empty of an autonomous existence. My only question or challenge for you is prying into what uses you make of emptiness? As a goal? As an explanation? As a basis for understanding? OR as an evasion? When does emptiness come in real handy for you? John the Pry-er > > On Mar 26, 2010, at 8:17 PM, John Carl wrote: > > > "Among the many forms in which human spirit has tried to express its > > innermost yearnings and perceptions, music is perhaps the most universal. > It > > symbolizes the yearning for harmony, with oneself and others, with nature > > and the spiritual and the sacred within us and around us. There is > something > > in music that transcends and unites. This is evident in the sacred music > of > > every community-music that expresses the universal yearning that is > shared > > by people all over the globe." > > > > -His Holiness the XIV Dalai Lama > > > > > > “I say we fill our guns full of love and we shoot for a new > > dream<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXg6Cm_T9fk> > > ” > > > > > > Trance Zen Dance is as cool name for a band, imo. They're a local > > group<http://www.trancezendance.org/home.html>that have been around a > > while so I've heard their names on the radio more > > than a few times, listened to a CD of their music once, from a friend. > > > > We went on a quick trip to Reno, again, while my eldest daughter Em is > home > > for Spring Break. > > > > So what I've been thinking about, between hotels, shopping and eating, is > my > > last post to Marsha, and why religious, spiritual or psychological are > all > > inadequate terms for transcendent experience. Even though transcendent > > experience is in a sense, psychological, spiritual and religious. > > > > But really, what it is most of all is experience which takes us out of > our > > static conceptions of self. Transcending our selves. > > > > The problem with labeling this experience "spiritual, religious or > > psychological" is that those are definitions of what lies beyond our > static > > conceptions of self. If we fully realize and conceptualize the > transcendant > > experience with these terms, then we block transcendance. For then, our > > "outside" has become part of our conceptual arrangemand we can no longer > go > > there in seeking escape from ourselves. > > > > We can't grasp transcendance. > > > > And I think Marsha knows this well, with her embrace of "nothingness". > But > > even nothing becomes something when it's abstracted and aimed at. So > that > > doesn't make me all that happy either. For instance, my nothing is > > completely different from your nothing, since my nothing is dropping MY > > patterns and your nothing is dropping yours. > > > > And then there's the thing that Ron points to with his Emerson quote: > > > > Fresh truth, like the thoughts of genius, > > > > comes always as a surprise, as what Emerson > > calls “the newness” (CW3: 40). He therefore > > looks for a “certain brief experience, which > > surprise[s] me in the highway or in the market, > > in some place, at some time…” (Z: 253). This > > is an experience that cannot be repeated by > > simply returning to a place or to an object > > such as a painting. > > > > A great disappointment of life, Emerson finds, is that one can only > > “see” certain pictures once, and that the stories and people who fill a > day > > or an hour with pleasure and insight are not able to repeat the > performance. > > > > ----- > > > > I'm almost tempted to say, "duh", Ron and Emerson, but that'd be > repeating > > a performance. > > > > > > Our language, > > Our language of creation, > > Language of liberation, > > We speak into that space > > That we call the now > > As we allow > > To let truth > > Teach us how. > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > > Archives: > > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > > > > ___ > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
