John, To be among the awakening.
Marsha On Mar 27, 2010, at 12:03 PM, John Carl wrote: > Marsha, > > I agree completely that self and object have no autonomous existence. > > >> >> And John, I prefer to use no-thingness, or better yet: emptiness, rather >> than >> nothingness. Self and objects are empty of an autonomous existence. > > > > My only question or challenge for you is prying into what uses you make of > emptiness? As a goal? As an explanation? As a basis for understanding? > > OR as an evasion? > > When does emptiness come in real handy for you? > > John the Pry-er > > > > >> >> On Mar 26, 2010, at 8:17 PM, John Carl wrote: >> >>> "Among the many forms in which human spirit has tried to express its >>> innermost yearnings and perceptions, music is perhaps the most universal. >> It >>> symbolizes the yearning for harmony, with oneself and others, with nature >>> and the spiritual and the sacred within us and around us. There is >> something >>> in music that transcends and unites. This is evident in the sacred music >> of >>> every community-music that expresses the universal yearning that is >> shared >>> by people all over the globe." >>> >>> -His Holiness the XIV Dalai Lama >>> >>> >>> “I say we fill our guns full of love and we shoot for a new >>> dream<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXg6Cm_T9fk> >>> ” >>> >>> >>> Trance Zen Dance is as cool name for a band, imo. They're a local >>> group<http://www.trancezendance.org/home.html>that have been around a >>> while so I've heard their names on the radio more >>> than a few times, listened to a CD of their music once, from a friend. >>> >>> We went on a quick trip to Reno, again, while my eldest daughter Em is >> home >>> for Spring Break. >>> >>> So what I've been thinking about, between hotels, shopping and eating, is >> my >>> last post to Marsha, and why religious, spiritual or psychological are >> all >>> inadequate terms for transcendent experience. Even though transcendent >>> experience is in a sense, psychological, spiritual and religious. >>> >>> But really, what it is most of all is experience which takes us out of >> our >>> static conceptions of self. Transcending our selves. >>> >>> The problem with labeling this experience "spiritual, religious or >>> psychological" is that those are definitions of what lies beyond our >> static >>> conceptions of self. If we fully realize and conceptualize the >> transcendant >>> experience with these terms, then we block transcendance. For then, our >>> "outside" has become part of our conceptual arrangemand we can no longer >> go >>> there in seeking escape from ourselves. >>> >>> We can't grasp transcendance. >>> >>> And I think Marsha knows this well, with her embrace of "nothingness". >> But >>> even nothing becomes something when it's abstracted and aimed at. So >> that >>> doesn't make me all that happy either. For instance, my nothing is >>> completely different from your nothing, since my nothing is dropping MY >>> patterns and your nothing is dropping yours. >>> >>> And then there's the thing that Ron points to with his Emerson quote: >>> >>> Fresh truth, like the thoughts of genius, >>> >>> comes always as a surprise, as what Emerson >>> calls “the newness” (CW3: 40). He therefore >>> looks for a “certain brief experience, which >>> surprise[s] me in the highway or in the market, >>> in some place, at some time…” (Z: 253). This >>> is an experience that cannot be repeated by >>> simply returning to a place or to an object >>> such as a painting. >>> >>> A great disappointment of life, Emerson finds, is that one can only >>> “see” certain pictures once, and that the stories and people who fill a >> day >>> or an hour with pleasure and insight are not able to repeat the >> performance. >>> >>> ----- >>> >>> I'm almost tempted to say, "duh", Ron and Emerson, but that'd be >> repeating >>> a performance. >>> >>> >>> Our language, >>> Our language of creation, >>> Language of liberation, >>> We speak into that space >>> That we call the now >>> As we allow >>> To let truth >>> Teach us how. >>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>> Archives: >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >> >> >> >> ___ >> >> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >> > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html ___ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
