Hi Marsha, Interesting topic.
What is a "successful" marriage? Does the fact that they are divorcing alone mean that their marriage was not a success? Best, Steve On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 6:28 PM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: > > Hi Ian, > > I'm very happy for you and your wife. It does my heart good > to hear of a comfortable ever-after ending. > > Tipper and Al Gore, are a couple everyone thought were still much > in love. They were thought to be, especially after Bill Clinton, a > model of the successful marriage. They were married at twenty > and twenty-one. Supposedly this breakup was a surprise to most > of their friends. > > Sorry about the pinhead remark. I was trying to get someone > beside the most wise John to respond. I'm happy you did. > I personally still do not think I would marry if I had it to do > over again. Marriage is too difficult. The expectations that > often accompany the marriage vows can sometimes ruin a > good relationship. - Although it might be nice to have a wife > to cook, clean and listen to my complaints. > > Marsha > > > > > > On Jun 7, 2010, at 5:23 PM, Ian Glendinning wrote: > >> As a non-inspector of non-pinheads Marsha, I'll give you my >> non-intellectual story. >> >> My wife and I have been married a little under 30 years. For the years >> between 10 and 25 we kinda developed an (mostly, but not entirely, >> unspoken) understanding that once the kids flew the nest we would >> probably split - like, what was the point staying together - christ, >> you know it ain't easy - too many snags etc. >> >> But to our mutual surprise, we discovered that we actually liked each >> other's company, doing things we like doing together, even though >> there are also things we each like doing that the other wouldn't be >> seen dead - posting on MD for example. It's not that the formality of >> marriage provides anything other than some nominal stability for the >> kids involved - like, they need it even if they don't know it - >> therefore a valuable social (even biological) convention, but that a >> life-long soul-mate has shared-values when all is said and done, and >> it's values that matter. >> >> Regards >> Ian >> >> On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 9:28 PM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> Hi John, >>> >>> I like the story, but I like all your stories. >>> >>> At first I thought a discussion concerning Tipper and Al a bit stupid too. >>> I agree; who cares? But it seems that the statistics point, not to the men >>> buying themselves a new trophy wife, but to the women wanting the >>> divorce, 60 - 70 percent. What's that about? It is mostly the wives >>> breaking up this social institution? "We've grown apart.", the mommies >>> are saying as they toss the guys out. >>> >>> The question today seems not to be 'Should a couple stay together for the >>> kids?' >>> It's more like, 'Should a couple get married for any reason?' Child >>> support can >>> be gotten with a dna test. Do today's kids care if their parents are >>> married? >>> Is marriage 'just' a social habit that has outgrown it usefulness? >>> >>> I wouldn't get married today, not at 20, 40 or 60. No way! >>> >>> I knew you would respond, John. You actually seem to have some real social >>> concern. Where do the rest of you inspectors of pinheads stand? Do you see >>> any value in the social pattern of marriage? >>> >>> >>> Marsha >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Jun 7, 2010, at 3:07 PM, John Carl wrote: >>> >>>> Well I'll take a non-intellectual stab at your question, Marsha. One of my >>>> favorite old couples in literature was Albert Durham and Hallie Ryder from >>>> a >>>> book I can't rememer the name of right now, about a coyote named Brand X. >>>> >>>> Anyway, they were childhood sweethearts who'd grown up next door to one >>>> another in a small town in Kansas, got married and had an only son who got >>>> killed in WWII. So they pulled up stakes, Albert sold his painting >>>> business, and they moved to an old mine in Arizona with a spring where >>>> every >>>> evening, all the animals would come and gather, and that was pretty much >>>> their social life. >>>> >>>> There was an old cabin on the claim, that appealed to Albert's spartan >>>> tastes, whereas Hallie prefered the neat little travel trailer with >>>> everything in its place, so they basically moved apart and avoided conflict >>>> and thus in their old age, reverted back to their childhood pattern of >>>> being >>>> next door neighbors. >>>> >>>> Their story always appealed to me, resonated with something that seems >>>> right, that marriage doesn't have to follow any particular pattern to have >>>> value. So Al and Tipper grew apart? So what? I think that's perfectly >>>> natural and right. Nobody said we have to turn into carbon copies of each >>>> other for the rest our lives, just because we partner up for raising kids >>>> and supporting one another. What I don't get is why they have to divorce. >>>> I mean, what's that about? The only reason they'd need to divorce is cuz >>>> somebody wants to what? Get remarried and have more kids? Find true love? >>>> Silly thing for an old fart to be chasing at this stage of his life. Poor >>>> Al. Hollywood musta gone to his head. >>>> >>>> >>>> John the anti-romantic >>>> >>>> >>>> On Mon, Jun 7, 2010 at 10:30 AM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> Greetings, >>>>> >>>>> All the buzz on the radio, because of Tipper and Al Gore, is whether the >>>>> institution of marriage >>>>> is falling apart. Because of the expanded longevity, can two people be >>>>> expected to commit >>>>> 'until death do us part'? Fifty years with one man, or woman? That is a >>>>> long time? With the >>>>> divorce rate above 50%, should this social pattern survive, change, >>>>> dissolve? >>>>> >>>>> What say you intellectuals about this social static pattern of value? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Marsha >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ___ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>>> Archives: >>>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>>>> >>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>> Archives: >>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>> >>> >>> >>> ___ >>> >>> >>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>> Archives: >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html > > > > ___ > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
