Hi Mark, On May 11, 2011, at 3:59 PM, 118 wrote:
> Mark: > What you say below is incorrect. You are speaking of the Social > Level. We think outside of language and only use it for > communication. Marsha: I am speaking about thinking, not consciousness. I am sure human beings are conscious of many experiences outside of language: smell, taste, hearing, touch and sight to name the most obvious. > Mark: > Many things are true to the individual; things are > only agreed on at the Social level. Marsha: I understand thinking to go on at both the Social and Intellectual Levels. > On Wed, May 11, 2011 at 1:51 AM, MarshaV <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> Hello Arlo, >> >> Been thinking that we can think and characterize reality only subject to >> language, which is conventional (sq) and says nothing ultimately true. Do >> you accept your last statement (Assimilating language...) as true? >> >> >> Marsha >> >> >> >> >> >> On May 10, 2011, at 12:21 PM, Arlo Bensinger wrote: >> >>> [Marsha] >>> Is this about an autonomous individual? >>> >>> [Arlo] >>> No. In this paragraph the author is stating the extremes, or poles, of >>> "structure" (determinism?) and "agency" (free will?). There have been other >>> terms for these, but within structuration theories (such as Giddens, >>> Archer, Parker and Bourdieu), these are recast not as antagonist forces, >>> but mutually enabling and mutually supportive. Agency is always enacted >>> within structure, and structure is always influenced by agency. Greater >>> structure brings greater agency, simplistically, rather than being >>> inversely related. The incredibly rapidity of world travel, and the ensuing >>> "freedom" to move around the globe, rests on a very complex structure of >>> mechanics, navigation, flight theory, schedules, airports, etc etc etc. If >>> you remove the structure, the agency of the individual to move around is >>> severely diminished. Moreso, Boudieu also considers the same duality >>> regarding "words" which Mark seems to suggest is a form of imprisonment. >>> Assimilating language provides us with far gre at >> er capacity to act than a feral human would have, albeit it at the same >> time (like roadways) channeling our thoughts in certain ways. >> >> >> >> >> ___ >> >> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >> > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html ___ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
