On Jul 31, 2011, at 5:42 PM, MarshaV wrote: > > On Jul 31, 2011, at 5:15 PM, david buchanan wrote: > >> >> >> Marsha said: >> Protagoras: “Man is the measure of all things.”, or as Lila might have >> interpreted it ‘All beliefs are true if you believe them.’ >> >> >> dmb says: >> >> Marsha think all beliefs are true if you believe them, and yet she has no >> idea why anyone would call her a relativist or why anyone would object to >> her interpretation of truth. >> >> Is it just me or is that a silly, silly, vacuous thing to say? Doesn't >> Pirsig say that beliefs are true to the extent that they work AS beliefs? >> Yes, and James's pragmatism will fill in the details of what that means for >> anyone who's interested in knowing about truth as "a species of the good". >> Ideas only become true in experience, when they are put to work in reality. >> And that's where our beliefs are wedged and controlled by the sensible flux >> (DQ) and the conceptual order (sq). That's what our truths have to answer to >> and beliefs are certainly not true just because they are believed. Without >> action, beliefs are literally meaningless. >> >> I mean, try ACTING on the belief that all beliefs are true. And then just >> watch as disaster unfolds. You will almost certainly crash and burn, maybe >> even literally. >> > > > Marsha: > If you promise not conflate relative truth and ethical truth, I will confess > that I do think truth is relative within the MoQ. I understand the MoQ to be > ontologically indeterminate and epistemologically relative. The last time we > had this discussion, you ran off never to be heard of again. But here from > the MoQ Textbook: > > "It's worth noting that the MOQ follows a pragmatic notion of truth so truth > is seen as relative in his system while Quality is seen as absolute." > > And if you need to be reminded once again of RMP's explanation that James' > pragmatism turns into ethical relativism without the evolutionary help of the > four levels. Of course you remember the discussion about the holocaust > producing satisfaction for the Nazis?
Marsha: I've never heard you state you weren't certain, or didn't know. I suppose that you think that what you post is true. But it is relative truth, relative to your particular static quality and the dynamics of the particular experience. It's why I find it soooo easy to ignore you. Imho, your understanding of the MoQ is as thin as the ink on the page. But that's relative to my understanding that a representative of the MoQ would demonstrate hand, head and HEART. I am such a dreamer.... ___ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
