David to Andre:
Is a 'referring term' not a definition? I think to some degree that it is..
Andre:
Well, I beg to differ David. I do not think that by referring to [DQ]
you in any way,shape or form are already defining it.Rather the referral
is made from that which it is not. The referring is a finger pointing
to... .
David:
Are you really comparing these thinkers by looking at them from the
perspective of how good they are? I don't think that you are. If you
would like to judge how good Christianity is or Northrop is or Buddhism
is - talk to me about them from the perspective of the best metaphysical
platform there is - The MOQ.
Andre:
Right, and they all point, in their various ways, their various insights to
Quality.
David:
Well, I'm not sure how you define 'contemplative path' however to me it
conjures up a path the intellect follows while it thinks about something...
i.e. not DQ.
Andre:
I'm thinking of a integration of 'being'(zazen) and 'doing'. Phaedrus sums it
up quite nicely:
"This inner peace of mind occurs on three levels of understanding. Physical
quietness seems the easiest to achieve...Mental quietness in which one has no wandering
thoughts at all [no 'monkey mind]...and value quietness, in which one has no wandering
desires at all but simply performs the acts of life without desire...". (ZMM, p 289)
David:
I see what you're trying to do. That is, to integrate what Wilbur has written
about the two schools into the framework of the MOQ. Something that I suggest
we ought to do above. This is the sort of thing that this board is built to
do.
Andre:
I agree.
David:
I don't necessarily agree with the analogies that you are drawing. While I do
agree that the Hinayana school of Buddhism seems only interested in 180 degrees
enlightenment, what's wrong with Pirsig's explanation of 180 degree and 360
degrees enlightenment in this regard?
Andre:
I wasn't aware that I suggested Pirsig was wrong with his explanation of the 180 and 360
degrees enlightenment. My comment referred to Marsha's claim that there is no
"I" in mindfulness. I disagreed and this can be verified through a reading of
the various Vedantic,(Zen)Buddhist and also Sufi and (gnostic)Christian literature. I
meant to say no more than just that.
Thanks David.
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