Hi Dan, Yes, Craig did speak wrongly where he wrote:
> A: It's true my car's in my garage. > B: It's not true, it's just a good idea. And it will serve me for replying to a post so ad-hoc. However Craig did repeatedly highlight the point that there is no difference between a good idea and truth which you did not appear to do so. Furthermore you seemed to speak as if truth was different to a good idea multiple times… >>> Well, Craig, you have never seen true. Ever. >>> Well, what I was asking is how do YOU know objects exist prior to YOUR >>> experience of them. >>> Do you really think you see the true light >>> of the world? The very same thing you accuse Craig of doing... But then I'm sure this goes back to our other discussion which I'm looking forward to finding the time to respond to.. Thanks Dan, -David. On 05/02/2013, at 6:58 PM, Dan Glover <[email protected]> wrote: > Hello everyone > > On Tue, Feb 5, 2013 at 1:46 AM, David Harding <[email protected]> wrote: >> Goodness Dan, >> >> I didn't realise that 'true' was a dirty word to you. > > Dan: > Well, it is a four letter word, after all. :) > >> >> True is high quality intellectual patterns. Like Marsha you want to >> associate the word 'true' to SOM and only take it in this context. In the >> MOQ true becomes high quality intellectual patterns. That's it. If an idea >> isn't good it's not true. If it is, it's true. That's it. Forget SOM truth - >> there is a better alternative Why do you refuse to see truth in this >> context? . > > Dan: > Within that context, it's fine. Craig did not seem to be using the > word in that context: > > What is the difference between what's true & what's a good idea? > A: It's true my car's in my garage. > B: It's not true, it's just a good idea. > A: But it's true that you see it there? > B: Thinking you see it there is just a good idea. > A: Walk across the garage; it's true that you'll bump into it. > B: That's just a good idea. > > Dan comments: > See? He is saying his car is in the garage. He then goes on to say it > isn't true--it is just a good idea. This is directly opposed to what > you just said: > > "In the MOQ true becomes high quality intellectual patterns. That's it." > > Dan: > Now, if truth is a good idea, or a high quality intellectual pattern, > why are you jumping on me and Marsha and not on Craig? He is the one > who is disagreeing with you, not us. > > Dan > > http://www.danglover.com > >> On 05/02/2013, at 3:08 PM, Dan Glover <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Hello everyone >>> >>> On Mon, Feb 4, 2013 at 8:05 PM, Craig Erb <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> Dan: >>>>> How do you know objects exist prior to your experience of them? >>>> >>>> Depends on the object. Take my car, for instance. When I first >>>> got it, there were documents with its Vehicle Information Number, >>>> showing when it was shipped to the dealer from the assembly plant. >>>> If you went back to the dealer, you could find records where the >>>> parts that were assembled came from. And they would have records >>>> where the raw materials came from, and records before that how the >>>> raw materials were gathered. Of course, it could all be one vast >>>> conspiracy, but unlikely. >>> >>> Dan: >>> Well, what I was asking is how do YOU know objects exist prior to YOUR >>> experience of them. Obviously with a car you know cars exist. They're >>> part of your cultural mores. Take this example: A couple are flying >>> over Africa and carelessly throw an empty Coke bottle out the window >>> of their plane. A jungle tribe finds the bottle. They have no >>> experience whatsoever with such an object. They conclude the gods must >>> have dropped it accidentally from the sky. Arguments and increasingly >>> vicious disagreements break out over who has the right to the object >>> of the gods. Finally, to ensure peace, a tribesman is picked to take >>> the bottle and throw it off the edge of the world where it will >>> trouble no one ever again. The Gods Must be Crazy! >>> >>>> >>>> Dan: >>>>> As long as it is understood that it is a good idea and not a true >>>>> representation of reality. >>>> >>>> What is the difference between what's true & what's a good idea? >>> >>> Dan: >>> Well, Craig, you have never seen true. Ever. Everything you know, >>> everything you sense, your entire world, has all been filtered through >>> your set of social and intellectual patterns that make up your >>> culture. Everything you sense has been filtered through that thing in >>> your head called a brain. Do you really think you see the true light >>> of the world? >>> >>>> A: It's true my car's in my garage. >>>> B: It's not true, it's just a good idea. >>>> A: But it's true that you see it there? >>>> B: Thinking you see it there is just a good idea. >>>> A: Walk across the garage; it's true that you'll bump into it. >>>> B: That's just a good idea. >>>> >>>> Whatever A says to B, B just says it's another good idea. And >>>> whatever B says to A, it's just more evidence that it's true that >>>> A's car is in A's garage. >>> >>> Dan: >>> Obviously the channels of communication have broken down once again. >>> Good luck on your endeavors to find the true and the real. >>> >>> Dan > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
