Krimel, Just stumbled over this post, explains quite a bit about the difference in how we are understanding the meanings of terms like "meaning" I have inserted some comments below. -Ron
________________________________ From: Krimel <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Saturday, March 9, 2013 2:34 PM Subject: [MD] Definitions [I present below, the "meaning" of a few terms as I am using them. I hope this will facilitate the transduction of what I compress in writing, into what you expand in the reading.] Chaos: I have tried a zillion time to explain this here and seem to have failed. Let's try this one from Nietzsche, "The overall character of the world is, for all eternity, chaos; not in the sense that it lacks necessity, but rather in the sense that it lacks order, articulation , form , beauty , wisdom , and whatever else our aesthetic anthropomorphisms might say." All of those things: lacks order, articulation, form , beauty , wisdom and not discovered in the world around us. They are invented by us in our ceaseless "aesthetic anthropomorphism."" Order can emerge from the irrational processes of autopoiesis or we can hammer it out, construct it, invent it through the processes of reason. Order is a subset of the chaotic. But both order and disorder are perceptual processes that we synthesize through rational and irrational evaluations of our experience. For those who still don't know what I mean by chaos, listen to this or just be quiet: http://www.radiolab.org/2009/jun/15/ All of human existence, is an effort to establish a harmonious aesthetic accommodation to chaos. [Ron comments] This explanation has yet to address the why, or the what for, of order arising from chaos. It simply introduces order in sideways like a god in a play. It neglects the good. Meaning: In information theory meaning is reduction in uncertainty. It is antientropic. Not a very satisfying definition to be sure. We know what "meaning" means but it is hard to pin down. [Snip]. Every one of us makes meaning. We synthesis it from experience and as a result each of us reads a different novel from the same set of symbols. Everyone here either knows or can easily look up everything Pirsig says. But each of us synthesizes their own meaning from the a static pattern of signs. Those patterns do not contain any particular meaning. They open a pathway for the synthesis of meaning. [Ron] Again the explanation does not account for the why, the good. If the world we live in is composed of value these terms must reduce down to a kind of good in some capacity. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
