Hi everyone, First - thanks for the very high-quality responses to my queries. Perhaps I asked too many questions in one post. I haven't time, unfortunately, to respond to all the excellent comments, so I will try to sum up my present thoughts, and hopefully address some of the issues raised... The reason that I called the post "the Illusion of Maya" is this: my understanding of the final insight of Zen is that, metaphysically, samsara/maya (relative phenomenal world) is NO DIFFERENT from nirvana/brahman (absolute enlightened reality). So the concept of Maya is itself an illusion!?!?!?!?!!! You ALREADY -are- Buddha-nature! Look: "Before (practicing) Zazen, mountains are mountains, and rivers are rivers. While in Zazen, mountains are no longer mountains, and rivers are no longer rivers. After Zazen (once enlightened), mountains are once again mountains, and rivers are once again rivers." "Q: How do I achieve enlightenment? A: When hungry, eat. When tired, sleep." (semi-quotes probably from one of D.T.Suzuki's books...?) The MOQ would translate thus: Static patterns of value are NO DIFFERENT from Dynamic Quality. How could they be? Everything is Dynamically static, and Statically dynamic. My concern is the throne on which DQ is placed. My take on the MOQ is this - it's very first and absolutely necessary principle is that everything is Quality. That means that sub's and ob's are Quality. That means that there is nothing else BUT sub's and ob's - patterns of value. You may call these patterns static, you may call them Dynamic. Each is both, relative to the angle of vision chosen. (Bergson's analytic, Pirsig's classic mode of human understanding - both give relative knowledge). Now, is ALL reality Quality? Phaedrus agrees with me: - "all of it...every last bit of". Pirsig, however, disagrees: - "reality (is) three things - Quality, mind and matter" - "empiricists keep trying to assign values to sub's or ob's. You can't do it. Values are a separate category all their own." Shit... gotta go. Sorry this is seriously incomplete...time... Rich ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com MOQ Online Homepage - http://www.moq.org Mail Archive - http://alt.venus.co.uk/hypermail/moq_discuss/ Unsubscribe - http://www.moq.org/md/index.html MD Queries - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
