Hi Andrew Yes that program will work - it just copies the image block by block to the CF card.
Dave On Monday, June 16, 2014 7:16:51 PM UTC-5, Andrew Bingham wrote: > > As far as writing images to the CF card, I'd expect > http://sourceforge.net/projects/win32diskimager/ would work just fine one > the image has been created. I used it to write the SD card image with the > giant CP/M software library for my N8VEM Zeta. It works with raw data. If > the IDE board is being used in LBA mode, I don't think the tracks/sectors > on the CF card matter since the CF card is just a bunch of LBAs at that > point. > > Andrew B > > On Monday, June 16, 2014 2:51:48 PM UTC-7, yoda wrote: >> >> Once we have the cpmtools working correctly it is much easier to build >> the complete image or even modify it on the PC. You can use cpmcp to copy >> any file you want into the image. Then for the Windoze people you can use >> an open source utility like Windd to copy the disk image to the CF. You >> don't have to mess around with Xmodem or MSDOS partitions, etc. It is >> really simple. And your solution does not address how to get things on the >> B drive. I will write this up when I have it working and the users can >> decide whether it is simple enough - it is very similar to what is done on >> the N8VEM branch of this group and it has worked well. >> >> Dave >> >> On Monday, June 16, 2014 4:33:03 PM UTC-5, monahanz wrote: >>> >>> How about we split the problem into two parts. >>> >>> >>> >>> First (using the Altair Simulator) we make a file that contains all the >>> sectors needed to boot up a non-banked basic CPM system. The console I/O >>> can be done by “poking” a few bytes into the image that contains the status >>> & data ports, the mask and value of bit(s) when for when a character is at >>> the keyboard (likewise for ready to display on console). That’s it. This >>> was the way old CPM programs did it for things like XMODEM etc. The >>> “image” need only contain the CPM3.SYS and CCP.COM files as well. >>> Other files can be on the B: drive and can be passed around freely, loaded >>> into RAM, saved, whatever. This core “program” can be tested by people >>> that have their IDE/CPM system up and running. Let’s not get hung up on >>> the holes issue. As I said the only reason I had holes was because I wanted >>> my initial CPM.SYS to work with a Seagate Hard disk and the CF cards. That >>> said I do seem to remember some of these CF cards had different >>> track/sector numbers. Have to think about that! >>> >>> >>> >>> The second step is (under windows) writing the data to a blank CF >>> card. There are a couple of ways this could be done. It could be a MSDOS >>> second partition way inside the CF card away from CPM and the monitor picks >>> it off (one time only) from there and a CPM SYSGEN like program writes a >>> traditional disk. Or alternatively a windows based program (probably C >>> based) just forces the data on to a blank formatted disk. Remember CPM >>> formatted sectors are different from MSDOS ones. CPM uses 0’s, DOS uses >>> E5’s or something like that. >>> >>> >>> >>> In this day and age there are probably a number of ways to do the second >>> step. We can call in one of the MSDOS Google Groups if need be. >>> >>> >>> >>> John >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* yoda [mailto:[email protected]] >>> *Sent:* Monday, June 16, 2014 2:00 PM >>> *To:* [email protected] >>> *Cc:* [email protected] >>> *Subject:* Re: [N8VEM-S100:4226] Re: A windows based program to write a >>> CPM3 image to a CF card for the S100 IDE board >>> >>> >>> >>> John >>> >>> >>> >>> Sorry that is not my goal. I think building the 2 files with altairz80 >>> is straight forward enough. It is building the image for CP/M that is >>> generally difficult especially if you want a set of working files on the >>> disk. It was virtually impossible with the holes in the disk which I think >>> we may now have solved. If you want to have a cpmldr and cpm3.sys for >>> serial and propeller then say copy one set to cpmldr.com and cpm3.sys >>> we can make that very easy. It is not quite as simple as you think of >>> poking bytes (if you need to initialize the serial I/O port for example). >>> The current ROMs don't need to be modified because they will load the >>> first 12 sectors in memory and go (no holes involved for track 0). >>> >>> >>> >>> Dave >>> >>> On Monday, June 16, 2014 3:42:21 PM UTC-5, monahanz wrote: >>> >>> Guys, remember in the end we need an idiot proof windows program that >>> will prepare a CF disk prepared on a windows PC that asks for only the >>> console status & data port, status bit true/false and boots up a non-banked >>> CPM3 (with say, 60K of RAM) when the first sector is placed in RAM at 80H >>> by a monitor (or by hand). I volunteer to be the idiot tester! >>> >>> John >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] *On >>> Behalf Of *yoda >>> *Sent:* Monday, June 16, 2014 12:44 PM >>> *To:* [email protected] >>> *Subject:* [N8VEM-S100:4226] Re: A windows based program to write a >>> CPM3 image to a CF card for the S100 IDE board >>> >>> >>> >>> Hi David >>> >>> >>> >>> Looks like progress - Yes it should be a BANKED CPM image. I will try >>> again tonight with your debug CPMLDR - I have not been able to get as far >>> as you have. Is your LBA routine now with the -1 or not?. >>> >>> >>> >>> I will look at my files again and make sure they are setup for banked - >>> though I had just re-downloaded John's file for banked version and changed >>> to use serial I/O and added your writelba routine. I did not check if all >>> the variables were set right. >>> >>> >>> >>> Dave >>> >>> >>> >>> On Monday, June 16, 2014 2:18:47 PM UTC-5, David Fry wrote: >>> >>> Hi Dave, >>> >>> >>> >>> currently looking at your disk image, layout looks fine. >>> >>> I have placed your image onto a CF card and over wrote your CPMLDR.COM >>> with one of mine that logs the sectors read to the screen for >>> troubleshooting. >>> >>> I can see the directory is read as sector 40H and CPM3.SYS starts to >>> load starting at sector 80H and loads 35 sectors in total matching the >>> directory entry of 9 allocation units. >>> >>> >>> >>> I have a question, the screenshot below would seen to suggest that this >>> image is a 'BANKED' cpm image, yet your HLDRBIOS.ASM has the Banked >>> variable set to 'false', which is it ? >>> >>> >>> >>> next question, have you added the LBA section in HIDE.ASM for CPM3.SYS >>> and removed the offset correction ? >>> >>> >>> >>> regards >>> >>> >>> >>> David Fry >>> On Sunday, June 15, 2014 1:46:12 AM UTC+1, yoda wrote: >>> >>> Hi David >>> >>> >>> >>> Had too many diskdefs and there was one in the directory where I was >>> doing things with the wrong format. The dummy.file I had created by dd 512 >>> bytes from a text file so that is why it was confusing so I made one with >>> just e5 bytes in it. I tried to remove the dec 1 instruction but still no >>> working. I still get a BDOS Err, Perm. when it jumps to LBA 0x40. Here >>> is the new disk and HLDRBIOS.ASM - see if you can figure out what is wrong >>> or how to load it. If we can get this disk to load and work - it is really >>> simple to make these and you can load whatever you want on them. >>> >>> >>> >>> Dave >>> >>> >>> >>> On Saturday, June 14, 2014 4:36:04 PM UTC-5, David Fry wrote: >>> >>> Dave, >>> >>> >>> >>> had a quick look at the disk image you uploaded and noted a couple of >>> things >>> >>> 1) sector 0 seems to contain text notes with the start of CPMLDR.COM >>> beginning at sector 1 as the first byte is 31H as you would expect. >>> >>> >>> >>> 2) the directory table entries seem to start at sector 61 ?? and not at >>> sector 64 where we would expect track 1 to start. >>> >>> >>> >>> A couple of thoughts, if the position of CPMLDR.COM is correct then we >>> can take out the -1 sector correction from the LBA routine and move all the >>> sectors up one position leaving sector 0 blank, this will also have the >>> effect of moving the directory table upto sector 40H where you expected to >>> see it (and in hindsight I agree) >>> >>> >>> >>> whats puzzling me at the moment is why is the directory table in sector >>> 61 when you created the image with 64 sec/trk. >>> >>> >>> >>> does cpmtools support 64 sector/track ? is seems to have set the image >>> to 61 sectors/track >>> >>> >>> >>> regards >>> >>> >>> >>> David Fry >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Saturday, June 14, 2014 9:35:29 PM UTC+1, yoda wrote: >>> >>> Sorry for previous - web posted before I was ready >>> >>> >>> >>> The diskdefs are: >>> >>> >>> >>> diskdef s100ide >>> >>> seclen 512 >>> >>> tracks 256 >>> >>> sectrck 64 >>> >>> blocksize 2048 >>> >>> skew 0 >>> >>> boottrk 1 >>> >>> >>> >>> I think the problem is the -1 but I am not sure - Track 1 sector 1 >>> should be 0x40 not 0x3F but I am not sure - tried commenting out the dec 1 >>> but that did not seem to help either. I have included my hldrbios.asm as >>> well >>> >>> >>> >>> Dave >>> >>> On Saturday, June 14, 2014 2:13:22 PM UTC-5, David Fry wrote: >>> >>> Hi Dave, >>> >>> >>> >>> thats right on a 64 sector border, this may be where my -1 or +1 sector >>> correction may be wrong. >>> >>> >>> >>> regards >>> >>> >>> >>> David Fry >>> On Saturday, June 14, 2014 8:00:09 PM UTC+1, yoda wrote: >>> >>> Hi David >>> >>> >>> >>> Sounds like a plan. I have made one and when it boots with debug >>> CPMLDR.COM reads LBA 3F and 40 then stops - that is where I am at. Let >>> me dig up an image and I will post here for you to look - at - think it is >>> pretty close >>> >>> >>> >>> Dave >>> >>> >>> >>> On Saturday, June 14, 2014 1:48:33 PM UTC-5, David Fry wrote: >>> >>> Hi Dave, >>> >>> >>> >>> If we can get the 'No holes' CF card layout to be compliant with cpmtool >>> then that has to be the way to go as it will make life much easier. >>> >>> As I said in a previous post, I welcome this 'no holes' lba to be picked >>> apart to get it right before we go too far down the road and find problems >>> later. >>> >>> >>> >>> I'm a little busy at the moment with various other aspects of my S100 >>> system with the little time I have to spend on it,(summer is coming after >>> all :-) ) >>> >>> If you can knock together a quick image with a CPMLDR.COM and CPM3.SYS >>> (doesnt matter what system it's for) then we could take a look to see how >>> the layout differs. >>> >>> My layout was derived from where CPMLDR was looking to find data. >>> >>> >>> >>> regards >>> >>> >>> >>> David Fry >>> On Saturday, June 14, 2014 7:30:00 PM UTC+1, yoda wrote: >>> >>> why not take a look at the cpmtools set. It has a program called >>> mkfs.cpm that will make a file as a cpm filesystem. You can specify a boot >>> image which it will lay down in the boot sectors. You can then use cpmcp >>> to copy files to the cpm filesystem. Then you can take the file and write >>> it block by block to the CF card. I did this originally to get my system >>> up and running. I actually used dd (a utility on linux or Mac) to write it >>> to the CF. I actually wrote a little script to take the file image and add >>> the "holes" back in so it would work with your BIOS. I went back and tried >>> it with the no hole version and had some difficulties that I have not >>> straightened out yet. I don't know if I did something wrong or David Fry's >>> LBA routine is not doing what I thought it did. I have not gone back and >>> investigated yet but with David's help we can probably probably get this >>> resolved. The procedure would go like this: >>> >>> >>> >>> 1) mkfs.cpm -f s100ide -b dummy.file -b CPMLDR.COM s100.dsk >>> >>> >>> >>> where s100ide is an entry in diskdefs that specifies the geometry of the >>> drive >>> >>> dummy.file is a 512 byte empty file to get CPMLDR.COM to be in the >>> correct sector start. >>> >>> s100.dsk is the file that represent the disk image. >>> >>> 2) cpmcp -f s100ide s100.dsk CPM3.SYS 0: >>> >>> cpmcp -f s100ide s100.dsk <cpm file> 0: copies <cpm file> to >>> user area 0 on disk image >>> >>> continue until you have all the files you want on the disk >>> >>> >>> >>> 3) use a disk image write tool (dd on Linux or Mac) to write s100.dsk to >>> CF card >>> >>> >>> >>> Here is a link to the cpmtools: http://www.moria.de/~michael/cpmtools/ >>> These tools run on Windoze for those that use that OS and easily compiled >>> for Mac or Linux. >>> >>> >>> >>> This is the way I am building my images for CP/M 68K that I am currently >>> working on. >>> >>> >>> >>> I think getting the diskdefs set write and a good writeLBA routine and >>> we should be able to get the procedure down. >>> >>> >>> >>> Dave >>> >>> >>> On Saturday, June 14, 2014 11:31:49 AM UTC-5, monahanz wrote: >>> >>> Guys, it’s great to see all the progress and uptake this simple little >>> IDE board has generated. Thomas in particular congratulations on putting >>> so much time and effort into “hammering into shape” the process for first >>> time installs. It helps tremendously but I think it will still be >>> difficult for some people to do. We all should remember how it was when >>> we first started! >>> >>> >>> >>> I’m wondering if somebody out there could spend the time writing a >>> PC/MSDOS based program to setup a CF card for first time users. If we >>> agree the IDE board ports start at 30H, the only variable would be the >>> console I/O. This could be either spliced into the final disk image with >>> the above program (leaving room in the base code with NOP’s) or by >>> answering a Q&A session and inserting code like the old XMODEM programs >>> did. A CF card is laid down as Dave describes and is checked out. Once the >>> image is laid down it can be dumped sector for sector any CF card (no >>> holes of course). The image can even include a few CPM programs. Probably >>> best to start with a non-banked CPM3 image. This program would run on a >>> standard PC, format the CF card and write the image sector by sector. Not >>> sure if Windows 7,8 allows you to do that easily but there must be a way. >>> >>> >>> >>> This would allow anybody not as sophisticated as some of us, to get >>> going right away and allow them to write more elaborate CPM3.SYS files that >>> include a FDC, printer etc. in the BIOS for their own hardware. >>> >>> I think something like this would be a tremendous asset for first time >>> S100 users. >>> >>> >>> >>> Any volunteers? >>> >>> John >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "N8VEM-S100" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "N8VEM-S100" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. 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