I value this list, though I am usually rather quiet about it. I think the conversations that I have read here and any we might have in the future are a practical impossibility on social media. Other peopel have already stated the reasons why.
I have not thought of this list as a place to post my work. As a place to post Alan's work, well yes. :^) Perhaps I should post some work, or work and words about it. Perhaps we all should. I hear what Ruth has to say about changes to the list. On the one hand, I like how it has been over the years I have been lurking, re3adn, and sometimes posting. On the tother, I believe having new people take on responsibilities is usually a Good Thing, especially for people who have had to do the work of maintaining and directing a list, but also for the energy and ideas that can follow. I wonder if as an adjunct to the list, some sort of video chat might occasionally be useful, if only to sit around talking, mayhap with beverage of choice. avanti, -- Paul On Mon, May 31, 2021 at 11:16 PM Alan Sondheim <[email protected]> wrote: > > I agree with you totally below. I've also learned new things, to be > honest, the discussions around Furtherfield and role-playing have been > fascinating and inspiring. And all that's to the good. I've also been more > or less meditating on Frankenstein - it's interesting that Science devoted > a special issue to the book a few years ago - the only work of art or lit. > that's merited the attention - > > And so forth and so on. I've been collaborating with Maria Damon and Azure > the past couple of days and that's been phenomenal and creative - > > Best Alan > > On Mon, 31 May 2021, Johannes Birringer via NetBehaviour wrote: > > > Date: Mon, 31 May 2021 20:58:58 +0000 > > From: Johannes Birringer via NetBehaviour > > <[email protected]> > > To: NetBehaviour for networked distributed creativity > > <[email protected]> > > Cc: Johannes Birringer <[email protected]> > > Subject: Re: [NetBehaviour] email lists - > > > > hello dear friends > > > > i use this address, as I know a few of you, or a certain number of you, > and have worked and corresponded with you. I value this list, and like > Alan, or Annie, and others i recently communicated with (for example with > Max Herman on the Mona Lisa), I enjoy learning about your work, your ideas, > your experiences. I am not sure anything has changed, at least not for me. > I look forward to postings here, my only other regular outlets are the > dance tech community, a debate forum called MOCO, and CRUMB, I have lost > interest in empyre (too academic and correct-theory speak driven, elitist > and unaware of its own elitism) but read it in on occasion, for > distraction, and I try to avoid instagram and facebook as a discussion > forum, as one cannot take them seriously. I am an older choreographer; so > Alan I read you, I mean I hear your rersponse, but 'old' means little. I > felt young yesterday, the sun laughed, people milled around, i was in > central London for the first time in 14 months, visiting a > n > > odd exhibit at the 'Royal Academy' called Emin/Munch, what more can one > ask for... > > > > take good care > > Johannes Birringer > > > > ________________________________________ > > From: NetBehaviour <[email protected]> on > behalf of Alan Sondheim via NetBehaviour < > [email protected]> > > Sent: 30 May 2021 23:52 > > To: NetBehaviour for networked distributed creativity > > Cc: Alan Sondheim > > Subject: Re: [NetBehaviour] email lists - > > > > I'd be sorry to lose that as well; I wish I could do something about it. > It seems to me, having just come out of the Electronic Literature > Conference, that new media work is more evident than ever, but perhaps > Netbehaviour is no longer the place for it - but as far as e-lists go, I > see nothing equivalent :-( > > > > Best, Alan, thank you for this -- > > > > On Sun, May 30, 2021 at 3:32 PM Edward Picot via NetBehaviour < > [email protected]<mailto: > [email protected]>> wrote: > > Alan and Annie, > > > > I think it's partly because people aren't posting their new work, or > notices about their new work, on here as much as they once did - which is > partly because a lot of people have moved away from New Media Art and gone > more into old-fashioned things like "pictures" and "writing", and > NetBehaviour doesn't necessarily feel like the right vehicle for those. I'm > spending a lot of time on Instagram these days, which I much prefer to > Facebook or Twitter, and I see that Michael Szpakowski and Simon McLennan > are both on there publishing new stuff on a regular basis. > > > > But I think NetBehavour still has this capacity to suddenly go from > being very quiet to being incredibly voluble and fast-moving if somebody > happens to raise a subject that really gets people thinking and talking. > I've never known another online forum quite like it as a vehicle for > debate, and I'd be very sorry to lose that. > > > > Edward > > > > > > > > On 30/05/2021 19:59, Alan Sondheim via NetBehaviour wrote: > > Dear Annie and netbehaviourists > > > > I do feel differently; I've had amazing exchanges with you and Johannes > Birringer and many others, and I can't imagine these occurring on Facebook; > the very phenomenology of the stream mitigates against that. I don't know > what you mean by "old" "intellectuals" since a number of people on the > lists are also young. The list isn't sex, but sex is and sex is a lot > faster than a list. It's the idea of "old" that bothers me; on Facebook > where I post, as I mentioned, I get numbers of likes or loves to an image, > but texts aren't taken seriously. > > > > Which for me reflects the whole intellectual apparatus of at least the > US and possibly Europe - the need to be an academic or gallery- or > magazine- affiliated. I have none of these and at ELO I felt for example as > a total outsider. And that's a real problem. There are constant money > issues, access issues, equipment issues, travel issues, survival issues, > health issues, audience issues, etc. that are available if not taken for > granted if you work at a university or tech company. Those issues dominate. > My equipment is seriously poor at this point. God knows what happens in the > rest of the world, where there may be no equipment at all. And these issues > are fundamentally class issues: the intellectual class, old or not, is > defined and siloed by its connections and potentials for connections. I > wake up sometimes thinking critically and artistically I'm dead and why > continue at all. And if I feel that way, again - God knows what happens in > the rest of the world. > > > > I don't read everything on mailing lists, but I take the time to at > least skim. And when I do reply (and I will always reply if I can to you, > for example), I'll do more than click stupidly on like/love/care/angry and > other emoji (which I use as well) (and which are frankly insulting - > someone takes the time to put up something that make take hours, weeks - > and the reply is a click?? > > > > It's the stream stream stream stream stream which is NOT flow but > inherently violent, sexist, racist, ageist, and anything else that > excludes. Influencers bet on it: become part of the part or I WAS HERE BUT > I DISAPPEAR. (maybe misquote from The Harder They Come). > > > > As far as NFT goes, I agree with your remark; again it drains any real > discussion re: violence, aesthetics, philosophy, sexism, racism, etc. .. > It's party time; you can't think against the stream; the boat you might > rock founders on it. > > > > As far as Netbehaviour goes, I do hope discussion and presentation both > pick up here. And I do NOT think it's an issue of age or intellectualism - > but a need for ANYONE to have a space to think and discuss slowly enough > within a space of consideration and considerateness... > > > > Best, Alan, and thank you for the reply. > > > > On Sun, May 30, 2021 at 11:55 AM Annie Abrahams via NetBehaviour < > [email protected]<mailto: > [email protected]>> wrote: > > Dear Alan and netbehaviourists > > > > I don't know why people write less in netbehaviour. Some hints: Email is > not the favorite way of communication anymore. Information is toooo much > everywhere, people tend to prioritise what is usefull. Etc etc. Mostly > "old" "intelectuals" exchanging ... The list isn't sexy ... > > I do miss the old mailing list where people discussed often without a > fear to be ridicule, could ask stupid (what is that?) questions and get > answers. But I admit I also don't always take the time to read all. > > > > Last week I posted a remark on a not to be mentioned social network " I > hate NFT - and am bored by it - no real perspective for change, just assets > - it is consuming my attention without giving me anything" and got more > than a 100 reactions, by far the most ever I think. I read it all, got > links to a multitude of articles I mostly had already read. > > And still I can't really make up my mind about it. > > Then I thought what I would need is not another article, nor a podcast > or talk, but a real conversation about this. A place to exchange about it, > a place where no-one tells me what to read, but carefully answers my stupid > questions, and asks me questions .... > > not an email exchange, but a conversation .... (that maybe could be done > via email exchange ..., maybe...) > > Such a thing is lacking! Especially in Covid times. > > > > Bye bye > > have a nice end of the day all > > Annie > > > > > > > > > > --------- > > Moving Paintings, net art Sans Objet< > https://www.centrepompidou.fr/fr/programme/agenda/evenement/8ZjR4xR>, > exposition en ligne Centre Pompidou, 19/05 - 19/11 2021. > > > > Videos from Utterings Supra Semiotics Performance and Panel discussion< > https://utterings.hotglue.me/?elo> <https://utterings.hotglue.me/?elo> > Toward a Supra-Semiotic Telepresent Communication ELO 2021 Platform (Post?) > Pandemic > > --------- > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, May 29, 2021 at 3:49 PM Alan Sondheim <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > > > I've noticed this, and many other lists, have gone mostly silent (except > > for neighborhood lists), and I'm wondering if this has to do with the end > > of many lockdown restrictions? Neighbors are taking care of neighbors, > and > > of course in-person contact has increased enormously. > > > > The lists served two purposes during the height of the epidemic; in > > addition to their stated content, they also upheld community. Now both > > seem to have gone silent, at least for the moment. > > > > Comments greatly appreciated > > > > Best, Alan > > _______________________________________________ > > NetBehaviour mailing list > > [email protected]<mailto: > [email protected]> > > https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > _______________________________________________ > > NetBehaviour mailing list > > [email protected]<mailto: > [email protected]> > > https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > > > > > -- > > ===================================================== > > directory http://www.alansondheim.org tel 718-813-3285 > > email sondheim ut panix.com<http://panix.com>, sondheim ut gmail.com< > http://gmail.com> > > ===================================================== > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > NetBehaviour mailing list > > [email protected]<mailto: > [email protected]> > > https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > NetBehaviour mailing list > > [email protected]<mailto: > [email protected]> > > https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > > > > > -- > > ===================================================== > > directory http://www.alansondheim.org tel 718-813-3285 > > email sondheim ut panix.com<http://panix.com>, sondheim ut gmail.com< > http://gmail.com> > > ===================================================== > > _______________________________________________ > > NetBehaviour mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > > > > > _______________________________________________ > NetBehaviour mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.netbehaviour.org/mailman/listinfo/netbehaviour > -- ----- |(*,+,#,=)(#,=,*,+)(=,#,+,*)(+,*,=,#)| --- http://paulhertz.net/
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