Thanks, that's the quote I've been looking for On Mar 18, 2009, at 4:06 PM, Creative Residential Designs wrote:
> It's whatever the manufacturer says to use. End of discussion. No > more oil threads of I'll commit electronic suicide! HotrodMamma. > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Graham Rogers > To: [email protected] > Sent: Wednesday, March 18, 2009 11:36 AM > Subject: [Nighthawk Lovers] Re: Gasoline, octane and oil > > Okay this one is just for clarification for our 28 year old son who > has a 2006 CBR1000. He wants to know what's the right oil for his > bike. I summarised the discussion here. He's skeptical because > some of his buddies give him such conflicting advice. One said > don't use Purple Royal ... it goes on. So would someone just say > again what would be the right oil for his CBR and say it with > authority, Graham (I will forward it on to him) > > > On Mar 18, 2009, at 12:48 PM, Kyle Munz wrote: > >> The only problem is a gallon of water is more than a gallon of gas ;) >> >> -Kyle >> >> On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 12:12 PM, stanley/ Randolph >> <[email protected]> wrote: >> The higher the compression ratio, the more likely you need higher >> octane fuel. You can overcome that neccessity with water >> injection, however, which lowers the temprature and at the same >> time makes a more complete burn because the fuel droplets surround >> the water droplets, being lighter; and when they burn, the water >> absorbs some of the energy and becomes steam very rapidly which >> makes the remaining unburned fuel droplets even smaller, so they >> burn faster and the burn completes before the flamewall gets to >> the top of the piston and through it, theoreticallyTo >> understand more clearly, picture a log. It takes it a loong time >> to burn, like overnight, for instance, in a Jotul stove. Now >> picture some wood shavings. They are not only easier to ignite, >> they burn quite fast by comparison. >> The gasoline gets "atomized" either by a carburetor or fuel >> injectors. The finer the droplets, the better the burn. >> Weber makes fine carbs that will cause the fuel to extract more >> power out of the same engine because the fuel comes out in such a >> fine mist. Sometimes it is so much more power that it is >> noticeable when you hit the gas. The engine will use less fuel, >> also, because more of what it gets, gets burned before the exhaust >> valve begins to open. >> Beetle engines came from the factory with about a 7.9:1 C/R. They >> can use 87 octane. >> If I were to up that compression in my engine to 10.5 or more, I >> would either have to use premium or add water injection. I choose >> the latter because I get more performance and nearly double my >> mileage from about 31 - 32 to about 58, give or take; plus, the >> engine stays cleaner; and unless you add an aftermarket filter on >> a Beetle, that's important, because they have no filter and I used >> to change my oil every 1500 miles. That wasn't so expensive, >> because Beetles only use 3 qts. of oil. Just a little more than a >> Nighthawk.. >> Actually, what Kyle said below is essentially the same thing; I >> didn't notice he wrote it after you asked the question (lol). >> And Kyle - I know of a chap who replaced the pistons in his Ford >> Focus with hi comp - 12.7s - and added water injection. >> That's all he did, and it increased his power (don't know how >> much, but a lot; no dyno) and his mileage went from 25 mpg to 50. >> This, on regular 87 gas. >> Kinda like NOS without the risk of blowin' yer engine... >> >> >> Stanley >> >> >> From: Javier Garcia <[email protected]> >> >> To: [email protected] >> Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 10:31:00 AM >> >> Subject: [Nighthawk Lovers] Re: Gasoline, octane and oil >> >> >> Stanley, I'm a little bit confused... in your first message it >> seems to me you don't agree in using high octane gasoline... in >> the second, you talked about engines damages due to the use of low >> octane gasoline... can clarify? I'm not really an expert, so I get >> lost very easily. >> Thanks, Javier. >> >> On Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 11:11 AM, Kyle Munz <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> I used to run into the same problem with my turbo cars. The higher >> the boost the higher the octane rating you needed since it >> effectively ups the compression. Most ppl understand octane >> meanings backwards. It actually means it's less likely to ignite, >> which is good if you're running high compression, or high boost. >> With higher gas prices I understand people wanting to put the >> cheap stuff in, but like Stanley says, newer cars will retard the >> timing when they detect knock, which means they burn more fuel >> anyways, so you didn't save as much money as you would have liked. >> One of the benefits of ethanol is a very high octane rating, so >> you could run really high compression or really high boost, and >> thus get more power, however this just isn't feasible for road >> cars now matter how much the corn lobby thinks it is. Long and >> short of it is, just put in what the manufacturer suggests, if the >> engine was designed for lower octane then put that in the tank. If >> you want to put "the good stuff" in your tank, then go to a name >> brand station, such as chevron/texaco, exxon/mobile, or shell and >> stay away from the discount dealers. This applies no matter what >> octane you decide to buy. >> >> -Kyle >> >> >> >> On Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 10:47 AM, stanley/ Randolph >> <[email protected]> wrote: >> If you know the research about octane and flamewalls and >> compression ratios, you would have a different attitude about >> that. Low octane fuel will demolish a high comp engine. I have >> taken apart Porsche engines they were putting in Beetle vans, with >> the rings all cracked and melted into their landings from using >> low octane for their compression ratio. And this despite the >> decal by the gas tank stating a minimum of 92 octane!!! >> This engine was still running, but I have seen engines with holes >> in the heads, the pistons, one which was ruined beyond >> repair with the hole outside of the valve insert. It is not good >> if you use low octane in a high comp engine. The flame wall is >> meeting the piston as it comes up, and when the heated wall of >> fire hits the piston and you hear the knock, back off, or you will >> ruin your engine. >> The engines today have knock sensors sending data to the computer >> to retard the timing when the flamewall gets too close to the >> piston crown. When timing was only a mechanically actuated >> centrifugal advance, one couldn't actually retard it, so the only >> thing one could do is back off the gas, or go around with >> permanently retarded timing, which defeats the purpose of higher >> compression: greater engine efficiency and/or more power. >> An old wrench gave me an engine for taking it out of this van he >> bought cheap and that's what I found when I took it apart. Happy >> to say, though, bottom end was excellent. Nice thing about those >> engines - is it was not too expensive to replace those pistons >> and cylinders. I had me a new engine for the labor and $80.00 for >> new set of P&C and a valve job with new exhaust valves. Gasket set >> was the second most expensive item: $29.00; for >> regular Beetle engines the gasket set was only $4.00, and a new >> set of P&C was less than $40.00 for Brazilian Cima/Mahles or a Jap >> brand name escapes me), both of which were close to German quality. >> The only safe thing to do when rebuilding the Porsche engines is >> to lower the C/R, because people think, it's just a VW (van/ >> microbus). It doesn't really need premium gas. >> Until, of course, it's usually too late... >> >> Stanley >> >> >> From: Creative Residential Designs <[email protected]> >> >> To: [email protected] >> Sent: Tuesday, March 17, 2009 7:37:45 AM >> >> Subject: [Nighthawk Lovers] Re: Gasoline, octane and oil >> >> Try telling that to my '69 GTO, Dick. It will NOT run on anything >> else...period. It doesn't care what you or I think about premium >> gas, it will ping and knock and carry on until I feed it the best >> gas there is. (Texaco or Shell premium ONLY). >> I just read a study on gas on the 'net as well. Interesting how >> abrasive low-end fuels are to an engine. I'll try and locate it >> again. Apparently it's one of those "you are what you eat" >> situations. HotrodMamma. >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Dick MacInnes >> To: [email protected] >> Sent: Monday, March 16, 2009 9:10 PM >> Subject: [Nighthawk Lovers] Re: Gasoline, octane and oil >> >> The only place to get the proper service Manuel is Helm. Inc >> And premium gasoline is a waste of money, I don't care what anyone >> has told you. >> >> Dick >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Nighthawk Motorcycle Lovers!" group. 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