Hello John
In reverse order, switching off drones is certainly a cop out if the
player is capable of tuning up properly in the first place otherwise
it seems fairly sensible to keep them off (in public at least) until
that stage is reached. I'm particularly thinking of the 'drones at all
costs' approach regardless of whether players are capable of getting
them in tune to start with and then holding them in tune for the
duration of the piece.
Re UP music after my last email I went to my album collection to see if
other respected Uillean pipers had the same approach to Paddy M. and
listened to one of my all time favourites, "Doublin'" by Keenan and
Glackin. Paddy K. not only uses the drones off technique on slower
tunes but also on reels such as"The Old Bush" and the "Boyne Hunt".
The hornpipe set "Plains of Boyle" and "Cronin's" and the jig set "My
Darling Asleep" and "Garrett Barry's Jig" are performed entirely
without drones and the interplay between chanter and fiddle is sheer
magic for me.
The way WGB tackles the drones on during a piece is to start on a
droneless set and then bring in a set with drones. As I realise not
every one's cup of tea but it butters my parsnip
and, of course, there has to be at least two of you.
Anthony
--- On Fri, 7/1/11, Gibbons, John <[email protected]> wrote:
From: Gibbons, John <[email protected]>
Subject: [NSP] Re: Drone Tuning
To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]>
Date: Friday, 7 January, 2011, 12:11
Anthony,
Certainly adding drones on the 2nd time through, works well on UP,
especially on airs.
Irish slow airs, being usually vocal music rather than pipe music,
maybe don't require a drone so fundamentally.
Musically this idea makes less sense on drone music though -
double-tonic tunes etc.
But with NSP, it is rare to have an on-off drone key, so it is hard for
us to do in practice.
As for drones being out of tune on recordings - as I said, it is the
effect on the listener which matters.
I can think of an otherwise excellent recording where the drones were
badly out in places, so I know what you mean.
But shutting them off is a cop-out, not a solution.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: [1][email protected]
[mailto:[2][email protected]] On Behalf Of Anthony Robb
Sent: 07 January 2011 10:52
To: [3][email protected]; [4][email protected]; Gibbons,
John
Subject: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning
What you say is true, but still ignores Paddy Maloney's point of
adding
drones further into (even 'proper') pipes tunes for greater impact.
We also have to remember that out of tune drones (and this
unfortunately is the norm it seems to me) do little to enhance the
music. This is true even in the most surprising quarters i.e. modern
recordings where retakes could be done fairly easily to correct
this.
Yes drones are wonderful and powerful but this power can also be,
and
all too often is, destructive.
Anthony
--- On Fri, 7/1/11, Gibbons, John <[5][email protected]>
wrote:
From: Gibbons, John <[6][email protected]>
Subject: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning
To: "'Anthony Robb'" <[7][email protected]>,
"[8][email protected]"
<[9][email protected]>, "[10][email protected]"
<[11][email protected]>
Date: Friday, 7 January, 2011, 10:17
Not at all - but pipes do sound better with drones, which are a
fundamental part of the instrument,
and also of what we might call 'proper' pipe music.
There are some tunes where drones don't work,
and some multi-instrument arrangements where they might get in the
way,
but - on pipe tunes at least - there is a price to pay if you shut
them
off.
My warning was just to your more literal-minded readers out there,
who might not think about the effect of their music on listeners.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: [1][12][email protected]
[mailto:[2][13][email protected]] On Behalf Of Anthony Robb
Sent: 07 January 2011 09:48
To: [3][14][email protected]; [4][15][email protected];
Gibbons,
John
Subject: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning
John, please remember I was talking in the context of switching
off
drones to let the music shine forth, not silly things like
playing a
semitone above everyone else!
Many general music sessions involve key changes from G to D to A.
Are you saying that pipes should not be adding their crystalline
punchiness to the mix just because they have to be droneless?
Cheers
Anthony
--- On Thu, 6/1/11, Gibbons, John
<[5][16][email protected]>
wrote:
From: Gibbons, John <[6][17][email protected]>
Subject: RE: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning
To: "Anthony Robb" <[7][18][email protected]>,
"[8][19][email protected]"
<[9][20][email protected]>,
"[10][21][email protected]"
<[11][22][email protected]>
Date: Thursday, 6 January, 2011, 20:50
"Others may not like it but at least you'll be pleasing the most
important person in this whole process, namely yourself. Which is
I
would argue is the main purpose of traditional music."
Pleasing everyone else in the room might be a priority for some,
as
well!
I have heard too many so-called traditional musicians play to
please
themselves (and nobody else) not to add this health warning.
You get them everywhere, but I recall the bloke who wound his
flute
up
to E flat because that's the key Matt Molloy played in,
though everyone else in the session was in D, and the one who
played
faster than everyone else because it was more exciting.
I've been the latter one myself on occasion....
Think about how it sounds for the rest of the world, and you will
play
better.
John
________________________________________
From: [1][12][23][email protected]
[[2][13][24][email protected]] On
Behalf Of Anthony Robb [[3][14][25][email protected]]
Sent: 06 January 2011 18:19
To: [4][15][26][email protected];
[5][16][27][email protected]
Subject: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning
--- On Thu, 6/1/11, [6][17][28][email protected]
<[7][18][29][email protected]> wrote:
It's a case of trying and seeing what you like. The other way
round
this would be for the piper not to play drones ... but I
wouldn't
recommend that approach.
cheers
Rob
Sorry to disagree, Rob, but occasionally switching the drones
off
to
let other instruments provide the accompaniment can be lovely.
I
would
also recommend learning and practising mainly on the chanter
alone.
It
is the way I was taught and was the Colin Caisley way
presumably
passed
on from Tom Clough. When Colin Caisley was chairman of the NPS
in
the
60s the Society hired out a 'goose' (bellows, bag and chanter
only)
for
people to try out the pipes.
Recently I came across an article, from the 70s I guess,
written
by
Paddy Maloney who suggests uillean pipers should learn on a
'goose'
for
3 to 4 years before thinking about getting drones. The premise
being
that the chanter is where the music is created and so needs to
be
learnt before adding drones or regulators. He also extols the
beauty
and effectiveness of playing parts of a piece on solo chanter
only
and
then adding accompaniment be it drones or other instruments to
lift
the
sound.
On a slightly related topic, people have commented on how well
in
tune
the 3 beginner pipers in Windy Gyle Band play on the CD and
have
suggested that some digital trickery might be involved. This
is
absolutely not the case. All three have learnt to play on
chanter
only
and two of them are now (after 3 years) beginning to add
drones
occasionally.
The drones can add excitement like nothing else to the pipes
sound
but
they can also mask some of the music at times. So my message
would
be
follow your ears, try all the options and go with what works
for
you.
Others may not like it but at least you'll be pleasing the
most
important person in this whole process, namely yourself. Which
is
I
would argue is the main purpose of traditional music.
Cheers
Anthony
--- On Thu, 6/1/11, [8][19][30][email protected]
<[9][20][31][email protected]> wrote:
To get on or off this list see list information at
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[23][34]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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[24][35]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
outh.ed
u
3.
[25][36]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=anth...@robbpipes
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4.
[26][37]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
edu
5.
[27][38]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rob....@milecastl
e27.co.
uk
6.
[28][39]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rob....@milecastl
e27.co.
uk
7.
[29][40]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rob....@milecastl
e27.co.
uk
8.
[30][41]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rob....@milecastl
e27.co.
uk
9.
[31][42]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=rob....@milecastl
e27.co.
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10. [32][43]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
11. [33][44]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
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[45]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
u
2.
[46]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
u
3.
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4.
[48]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
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[50]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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[51]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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[52]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
9.
[53]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
10.
[54]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
11.
[55]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
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[57]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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15.
[59]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
16.
[60]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
17.
[61]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
18.
[62]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
19.
[63]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
20.
[64]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
21. [65]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
22. [66]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
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[67]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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[68]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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25.
[69]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
26.
[70]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
27.
[71]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
28.
[72]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
29.
[73]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
30.
[74]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
31.
[75]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected].
uk
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7. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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23. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
24. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
25. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
26. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
27. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
28. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
29. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
30. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
31. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
32. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
33. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
34. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
35. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
36. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
37. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
38. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
39. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
40. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
41. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
42. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
43. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
44. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
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51. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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55. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
56. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
57. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
58. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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60. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
61. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
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63. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
64. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]
65. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
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