I agree, it made sense for me as an isolated complete beginner. Interesting discussion re uillean pipes, as one of the only Northumbrian pipers in Ireland (and can barely call meself that) I found that when I contacted a few uillean pipemakers here, I was surprised how little they knew about the nsp.
On 7 Jan 2011, at 19:00, Francis Wood <[email protected]> wrote: > Colin, the thing you recall is Rob Say's Northumbrian Smallpipes Simulator: > > http://www.milecastle27.co.uk/simulator/ > > I'm sure that Rob might reply himself, omitting to say how absolutely > brilliant it is. > > So I shall do so instead. > > Francis > > On 7 Jan 2011, at 18:53, Colin wrote: > >> This talk of drone tuning reminded me of something. >> Some years ago, someone on this list directed us to a website which had (I >> hope I can explain this and make sense) a keynote playing and you had to use >> sliders to tune the drones (using the mouse) and got a score for how near >> you were (it was an aid to tuning by ear) and showed how far out you were (I >> think it also had a "this is how it should sound" audio as well). >> Anyone remember it (I lost the URL several PCs ago) and does it still exist? >> >> Colin Hill >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gibbons, John" <[email protected]> >> To: <[email protected]> >> Sent: Friday, January 07, 2011 12:11 PM >> Subject: [NSP] Re: Drone Tuning >> >> >>> >>> Anthony, >>> >>> Certainly adding drones on the 2nd time through, works well on UP, >>> especially on airs. >>> Irish slow airs, being usually vocal music rather than pipe music, maybe >>> don't require a drone so fundamentally. >>> Musically this idea makes less sense on drone music though - double-tonic >>> tunes etc. >>> But with NSP, it is rare to have an on-off drone key, so it is hard for us >>> to do in practice. >>> >>> As for drones being out of tune on recordings - as I said, it is the effect >>> on the listener which matters. >>> I can think of an otherwise excellent recording where the drones were badly >>> out in places, so I know what you mean. >>> But shutting them off is a cop-out, not a solution. >>> >>> John >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On >>> Behalf Of Anthony Robb >>> Sent: 07 January 2011 10:52 >>> To: [email protected]; [email protected]; Gibbons, John >>> Subject: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning >>> >>> >>> What you say is true, but still ignores Paddy Maloney's point of adding >>> drones further into (even 'proper') pipes tunes for greater impact. >>> We also have to remember that out of tune drones (and this >>> unfortunately is the norm it seems to me) do little to enhance the >>> music. This is true even in the most surprising quarters i.e. modern >>> recordings where retakes could be done fairly easily to correct this. >>> Yes drones are wonderful and powerful but this power can also be, and >>> all too often is, destructive. >>> Anthony >>> --- On Fri, 7/1/11, Gibbons, John <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> From: Gibbons, John <[email protected]> >>> Subject: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning >>> To: "'Anthony Robb'" <[email protected]>, "[email protected]" >>> <[email protected]>, "[email protected]" >>> <[email protected]> >>> Date: Friday, 7 January, 2011, 10:17 >>> >>> Not at all - but pipes do sound better with drones, which are a >>> fundamental part of the instrument, >>> and also of what we might call 'proper' pipe music. >>> There are some tunes where drones don't work, >>> and some multi-instrument arrangements where they might get in the way, >>> but - on pipe tunes at least - there is a price to pay if you shut them >>> off. >>> My warning was just to your more literal-minded readers out there, >>> who might not think about the effect of their music on listeners. >>> John >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: [1][email protected] >>> [mailto:[2][email protected]] On Behalf Of Anthony Robb >>> Sent: 07 January 2011 09:48 >>> To: [3][email protected]; [4][email protected]; Gibbons, >>> John >>> Subject: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning >>> John, please remember I was talking in the context of switching off >>> drones to let the music shine forth, not silly things like playing a >>> semitone above everyone else! >>> Many general music sessions involve key changes from G to D to A. >>> Are you saying that pipes should not be adding their crystalline >>> punchiness to the mix just because they have to be droneless? >>> Cheers >>> Anthony >>> --- On Thu, 6/1/11, Gibbons, John <[5][email protected]> >>> wrote: >>> From: Gibbons, John <[6][email protected]> >>> Subject: RE: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning >>> To: "Anthony Robb" <[7][email protected]>, >>> "[8][email protected]" >>> <[9][email protected]>, "[10][email protected]" >>> <[11][email protected]> >>> Date: Thursday, 6 January, 2011, 20:50 >>> "Others may not like it but at least you'll be pleasing the most >>> important person in this whole process, namely yourself. Which is I >>> would argue is the main purpose of traditional music." >>> Pleasing everyone else in the room might be a priority for some, as >>> well! >>> I have heard too many so-called traditional musicians play to please >>> themselves (and nobody else) not to add this health warning. >>> You get them everywhere, but I recall the bloke who wound his flute >>> up >>> to E flat because that's the key Matt Molloy played in, >>> though everyone else in the session was in D, and the one who played >>> faster than everyone else because it was more exciting. >>> I've been the latter one myself on occasion.... >>> Think about how it sounds for the rest of the world, and you will >>> play >>> better. >>> John >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: [1][12][email protected] >>> [[2][13][email protected]] On >>> Behalf Of Anthony Robb [[3][14][email protected]] >>> Sent: 06 January 2011 18:19 >>> To: [4][15][email protected]; [5][16][email protected] >>> Subject: [NSP] Re: Concertina Tuning >>> --- On Thu, 6/1/11, [6][17][email protected] >>> <[7][18][email protected]> wrote: >>> It's a case of trying and seeing what you like. The other way >>> round >>> this would be for the piper not to play drones ... but I wouldn't >>> recommend that approach. >>> cheers >>> Rob >>> Sorry to disagree, Rob, but occasionally switching the drones off >>> to >>> let other instruments provide the accompaniment can be lovely. I >>> would >>> also recommend learning and practising mainly on the chanter >>> alone. >>> It >>> is the way I was taught and was the Colin Caisley way presumably >>> passed >>> on from Tom Clough. When Colin Caisley was chairman of the NPS in >>> the >>> 60s the Society hired out a 'goose' (bellows, bag and chanter >>> only) >>> for >>> people to try out the pipes. >>> Recently I came across an article, from the 70s I guess, written >>> by >>> Paddy Maloney who suggests uillean pipers should learn on a >>> 'goose' >>> for >>> 3 to 4 years before thinking about getting drones. The premise >>> being >>> that the chanter is where the music is created and so needs to be >>> learnt before adding drones or regulators. He also extols the >>> beauty >>> and effectiveness of playing parts of a piece on solo chanter >>> only >>> and >>> then adding accompaniment be it drones or other instruments to >>> lift >>> the >>> sound. >>> On a slightly related topic, people have commented on how well in >>> tune >>> the 3 beginner pipers in Windy Gyle Band play on the CD and have >>> suggested that some digital trickery might be involved. This is >>> absolutely not the case. All three have learnt to play on chanter >>> only >>> and two of them are now (after 3 years) beginning to add drones >>> occasionally. >>> The drones can add excitement like nothing else to the pipes >>> sound >>> but >>> they can also mask some of the music at times. So my message >>> would >>> be >>> follow your ears, try all the options and go with what works for >>> you. >>> Others may not like it but at least you'll be pleasing the most >>> important person in this whole process, namely yourself. Which is >>> I >>> would argue is the main purpose of traditional music. >>> Cheers >>> Anthony >>> --- On Thu, 6/1/11, [8][19][email protected] >>> <[9][20][email protected]> wrote: >>> To get on or off this list see list information at >>> [1][10][21]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >>> -- >>> References >>> 1. [11][22]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >>> -- >>> References >>> 1. >>> [23]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> u >>> 2. >>> [24]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> u >>> 3. >>> [25]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 4. >>> [26]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 5. >>> [27]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]. >>> uk >>> 6. >>> [28]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]. >>> uk >>> 7. >>> [29]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]. >>> uk >>> 8. >>> [30]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]. >>> uk >>> 9. >>> [31]http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected]. >>> uk >>> 10. [32]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >>> 11. [33]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >>> >>> -- >>> >>> References >>> >>> 1. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 2. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 3. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 4. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 5. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 6. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 7. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 8. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 9. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 10. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 11. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 12. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 13. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 14. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 15. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 16. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 17. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 18. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 19. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 20. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 21. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >>> 22. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >>> 23. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 24. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 25. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 26. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 27. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 28. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 29. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 30. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 31. http://uk.mc5.mail.yahoo.com/mc/[email protected] >>> 32. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >>> 33. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > > >
