On 1/30/2017 11:38 AM, Linda Dunbar wrote:
>
> Joe,
>
>
>
> You asked:
>
> What makes NVO3 different from any other network?
>
>
>
> Answer: Some NVEs, especially the NVE implemented on server, don’t
> support PIM or other multicast mechanism. They just encapsulate the
> data packets from VMs with an outer header.
>
Then the requirement would be:
NVO3 does not require native multicast, but does require supported
multicast capability.
> The “UNIQUE needs of NVO3” is to have the mechanism for NVEs
> (especially the ones that don’t support multicast) to map multicast
> traffic from VMs (users/applications) to proper Outer Header. E.g. if
> NVE doesn’t support multicast (PIM), what outer destination address
> should be.
>
That needs to be explained in detail, especially for ways to support
multicast without PIM.
> All we need is to differentiate multicast messages originated from
> users/applications from the infrastructure multicast at the
> introduction section. Not intended to describe in detail of the
> Infrastructure multicast.
>
>
>
> I don’t understand how RFC3819 (Advice for Internet Subnetwork
> Designs) can be used. RFC 3819 talks about MTU, TCP/link
> retransmission, etc.
>
See sections 5 and 6.
Joe
>
>
>
>
> Linda Dunbar
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:*Joe Touch [mailto:[email protected]]
> *Sent:* 2017年1月30日12:42
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <[email protected]>; Olufemi Komolafe
> <[email protected]>; Anoop Ghanwani <[email protected]>; Bocci,
> Matthew (Nokia - GB) <[email protected]>
> *Cc:* MBONED WG <[email protected]>; Truman Boyes
> <[email protected]>; <[email protected]> <[email protected]>; Williamson,
> Beau <[email protected]>; Dino Farinacci <[email protected]>
> *Subject:* Re: [nvo3] [MBONED] NVO3 Multicast Framework
>
>
>
> Note: most of what you want to say about multicast has already been
> observed in RFC 3819.
>
> The discussion in section 1.1 should refer to LANE (RFC1577) as an
> example.
>
> However, before we get down into this in detail, I have to ask: what
> makes NVO3 different from any other network?
>
> This WG doesn't need one doc for everything an NVO3 network needs that
> a network already needs. The docs should focus on the UNIQUE needs of
> NVO3 or ways in which NVO3 provides multicast that are not available
> in generic networks.
>
> The rest of the discussion of the need for multicast, etc., ought to
> cite existing RFCs.
>
> Joe
>
> On 1/30/2017 10:35 AM, Joe Touch wrote:
>
> Hi, Linda,
>
> This isn't correct grammar.
>
> Do you want to say:
>
> /Infrastructure multicast /*is a capability needed by */networking
> services//, such as Address Resolution Protocol (ARP), Neighbor
> Discovery (ND), Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol (DHCP),
> multicast Domain Name Server (mDNS), etc../
>
> Joe
>
> On 1/30/2017 10:21 AM, Linda Dunbar wrote:
>
> Joe,
>
>
>
> Are you ok with the following?
>
>
>
> /Infrastructure multicast are //for networking services//,
> such as Address Resolution Protocol (ARP), Neighbor Discovery
> (ND), Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol (DHCP), multicast
> Domain Name Server (mDNS), etc../
>
>
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:*Joe Touch [mailto:[email protected]]
> *Sent:* 2017年1月30日12:03
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Olufemi Komolafe
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>; Anoop
> Ghanwani <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Bocci, Matthew (Nokia - GB)
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
> *Cc:* MBONED WG <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>;
> Truman Boyes <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>;
> Williamson, Beau <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Dino Farinacci
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
> *Subject:* Re: [nvo3] [MBONED] NVO3 Multicast Framework
>
>
>
> I'd suggest "networking services", only to avoid the
> implication that these are all L3.
>
> Joe
>
>
>
> On 1/30/2017 9:58 AM, Linda Dunbar wrote:
>
> Joe,
>
>
>
> Do you mean the following?
>
>
>
> /Infrastructure multicast are originated by network
> //services //for the purpose of establishing network
> topology and reachability, such as Address Resolution
> Protocol (ARP), Neighbor Discovery (ND), Dynamic Host
> Configuration Protocol (DHCP), multicast Domain Name
> Server (mDNS), etc../
>
>
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:*Joe Touch [mailto:[email protected]]
> *Sent:* 2017年1月30日11:49
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Olufemi Komolafe
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>;
> Anoop Ghanwani <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Bocci, Matthew (Nokia -
> GB) <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
> *Cc:* MBONED WG <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Truman Boyes
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>;
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]> <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Williamson, Beau
> <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Dino Farinacci
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
> *Subject:* Re: [nvo3] [MBONED] NVO3 Multicast Framework
>
>
>
> Hi, Linda,
>
> These are not all "network protocols", as I noted already.
>
> It might be useful to describe them all as "services", though.
>
> I.e., to replate "network protocols" with "services" (or
> maybe even "networking services" - to distinguish them
> from OS services, but not give the impression they belong
> at the "network" layer).
>
> Joe
>
>
>
> On 1/30/2017 8:17 AM, Linda Dunbar wrote:
>
> Joe,
>
>
>
> Thank you very much for articulating a more precise
> definition.
>
>
>
> How about this:
>
> /Infrastructure multicast are originated by network
> //protocols //for the purpose of establishing network
> topology and reachability, such as Address Resolution
> Protocol (ARP), Neighbor Discovery (ND), Dynamic Host
> Configuration Protocol (DHCP), multicast Domain Name
> Server (mDNS), etc../
>
>
>
> /Application-specific multicast traffic are originated
> and consumed by user applications./
>
> Linda
>
>
>
> *From:*Joe Touch [mailto:[email protected]]
> *Sent:* 2017年1月27日18:20
> *To:* Linda Dunbar <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Olufemi Komolafe
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>;
> Anoop Ghanwani <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Bocci, Matthew (Nokia
> - GB) <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>
> *Cc:* MBONED WG <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Truman Boyes
> <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]> <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Williamson, Beau
> <[email protected]>
> <mailto:[email protected]>; Dino Farinacci
> <[email protected]> <mailto:[email protected]>
> *Subject:* Re: [nvo3] [MBONED] NVO3 Multicast Framework
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 1/27/2017 4:03 PM, Linda Dunbar wrote:
>
> /[Linda] //Infrastructure multicast are originated
> by network nodes for the purpose of establishing
> network topology and reachability, such as Address
> Resolution Protocol (ARP), Neighbor Discovery
> (ND), Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol (DHCP),
> multicast Domain Name Server (mDNS), etc../
>
> + Also, how would you classify protocols like
> OSPF, PIM, VRRP etc that are dependent on
> multicast? Even if you do not consider them
> relevant for this framework, perhaps you should
> briefly mention them?
>
> /[Linda] I don’t think we can enumerate all
> network protocols (many of them use multicast).
> The purpose is to differentiate multicast
> originated by network nodes and the multicast
> originated by applications. /
>
> DHCP and mDNS are applications ("L7").
>
> Network nodes don't originate anything; their protocol
> layers do (link, network, transport, application).
>
> It might be useful to focus on the difference being
> "network infrastructure" vs "user applications" as the
> better way to describe the difference. I don't think
> "network nodes vs. applications" is clear or meaningful.
>
> Joe
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
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