Thanks Brian. I see also from the wiki that there is an IRC channel as requested: https://www.irccloud.com/#!/ircs://irc.freenode.net:6697/%23onap-modeling
I recommend we get the LF infra team to setup a bot there to log the channel for the minutes. We can also let people use the zoom chat and paste that into the IRC channel at the end of the meeting, so it’s part of the minutes. Thanks, Bryan Sullivan | AT&T From: onap-discuss-boun...@lists.onap.org [mailto:onap-discuss-boun...@lists.onap.org] On Behalf Of Brian Hedstrom Sent: Tuesday, May 16, 2017 7:01 AM To: onap-discuss@lists.onap.org Subject: Re: [onap-discuss] [Modeling] agenda for today teleconf Here are the ZOOM chat notes from the Modeling meeting today. 07:38:25 From Bryan Sullivan : I disagree in principle that declarative methods can'rt handle complex use cases. 07:39:33 From DENG Hui : Bryan, do you have example, how vendor's volte could be deployed based on declarative methods? 07:39:37 From Bryan Sullivan : Dependencies as an example is clearly supported by a declarative model, and can be used to derive VNFC sequencing. 07:40:09 From Alex Vul : I agree with Bryan... 07:40:24 From Bryan Sullivan : You need to list the particular aspects of the model (actions in a deployment process for example) that need to be assessed per support in declarative means. 07:40:51 From Bryan Sullivan : Do we have an IRC channel for the meeting? Will be more effective than this chat tool. 07:41:35 From Alex Vul : just look at the VMware proprietary implementaton or the BMC one, or examples of complex SAP landscapes that have been modelled in TOSCA 07:42:08 From Alex Vul : the complexity of SAP landscapes rivals what we need to do in terms of network services, VNFs and SFCs 07:42:20 From Bryan Sullivan : Also, the Cloudify DSL has a lot of complex features that they have extended TOSCA with. These have not worked into the standard but are a clear example of how to declaratively model complex features. 07:43:34 From Alex Vul : I have been working with declarative orchestrators for more than 10 years - they can do the job... 07:44:15 From maopeng : could the Tosca deal with both deploy and upgrade？ 07:44:16 From Bryan Sullivan : Same for JuJu, which uses a largely declarative approach, supplemented by scripts where needed for any detailed actions not yet supported by the model DSL. This is a common technique, and is a design decision in the end (how much to script based upon lifecycle hook calls). 07:45:14 From DENG Hui : one more clarification again: is there any vendor's VOLTE could be deployed based on declarative model? please show the example, 07:45:20 From Bryan Sullivan : I see no reason that upgrade cannot be represented by a reference to a dependent artifact that has changed version (upgrade or downgrade), based upon the current running state of a VNF. 07:45:38 From DENG Hui : today's svnfm is under JUJU, 07:45:44 From Alex Vul : TOSCA *is* for deployment 07:46:22 From maopeng : @Alex，just for deployment？ 07:46:30 From Bryan Sullivan : Deng, the "vendor's VOLTE" example needs to be defined re requirements by the vendor. We can't in a generic sense respond to a particular example withouth understanding the assumptions/requirements of that example. 07:46:38 From Alex Vul : you can also orchestrate upgrades/updates 07:47:07 From Amir Levy : @DENG - we have ran VoLTE over declarative model using Cloudify 07:47:10 From Alex Vul : the containment graph is helpful for in-service upgrades 07:47:34 From Amir Levy : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NfkCkj3Hd8U<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.youtube.com_watch-3Fv-3DNfkCkj3Hd8U&d=DwMFaQ&c=LFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=2-FskNSRL5sc9nQutgafCDIk3JbYrtcUwMwT5Zs1Tnk&m=Rgmc1JpyXlbitlUTK3B3w4xSmioN1q33FRvR_XPR19g&s=TiAnBbUpznRZzfkKGWvkJYgLF000tVKT17T0zpOcKMk&e=> 07:47:48 From DENG Hui : @amir, which operator , and which telecom vendor, don't tell me that is open source 07:48:25 From maopeng : one Tosca file or two files do deploy and update? 07:48:26 From Amir Levy : @DENG check out - OPNFV / ClearWater 07:48:35 From Bryan Sullivan : Deng, where possible we should always use open source examples to develop ONAP functionality. 07:48:55 From Bryan Sullivan : (if I understood your point/question) 07:49:05 From DENG Hui : Bryan, we are talking about commerical value and commerical deployment, not just for academy based on open source vnf 07:51:18 From Bryan Sullivan : If we can't derive clear deployable platform value from developing a platform using open source reference VNFs, then we might as well go home now. That does not impact your ability to deploy proprietary "real" VNFs, or diminish the potential quality of the platform to support them. We just have to do a thorough job using open source tools including VNFs. 07:51:20 From maopeng : if the deploy and the update have the different relations or other depandencies running state, how to do that? 07:52:02 From Alex Vul : can you elaborate maopeng... 07:52:19 From Bryan Sullivan : We are not in a science experiment here; we are working in the open on a real deployable platform. We just need to keep all the components of the project discussion open and free. 07:54:20 From maopeng : @alex, we can discuss offline 07:54:32 From Ranny Haiby (Nokia) : Nokia successfully deployed a commercial IMS using a TOSCA driven templates decribed here:https://tools.ext.nokia.com/asset/200827<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__tools.ext.nokia.com_asset_200827&d=DwMFaQ&c=LFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=2-FskNSRL5sc9nQutgafCDIk3JbYrtcUwMwT5Zs1Tnk&m=Rgmc1JpyXlbitlUTK3B3w4xSmioN1q33FRvR_XPR19g&s=itGdQtNdjireYXtzRq9EZqnWjy-SO5rdHxLjC7fxnzU&e=> 07:54:36 From Alex Vul : sure... i spent 15 years working on app modeling... 07:54:59 From Alex Vul : what Huabing is proposing is actually one implementation that I have done... 07:55:21 From Bryan Sullivan : Do these chat notes get published in the minutes? If not we need to start using IRC so the notes are minuted. On Tue, May 16, 2017 at 6:00 AM, denghui (L) <denghu...@huawei.com<mailto:denghu...@huawei.com>> wrote: Hello all We are going to have teleconf in an hour, agenda would be: 1) Working through other Modeling related projects, suggested influence. (All) 2) Combination of declarative and imperative workflow with BPMN (Huabin Zhao) Thanks Rittwik and Deng Hui _______________________________________________ onap-discuss mailing list onap-discuss@lists.onap.org<mailto:onap-discuss@lists.onap.org> https://lists.onap.org/mailman/listinfo/onap-discuss<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__lists.onap.org_mailman_listinfo_onap-2Ddiscuss&d=DwMFaQ&c=LFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=2-FskNSRL5sc9nQutgafCDIk3JbYrtcUwMwT5Zs1Tnk&m=Rgmc1JpyXlbitlUTK3B3w4xSmioN1q33FRvR_XPR19g&s=iF1QTYGO9ZIdCLbOfF1IqbZDj1AvoFZNo2PeAzFtJSk&e=> -- Brian Hedstrom Founder/CEO OAM Technology Consulting LLC oamtechnologyconsulting.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__oamtechnologyconsulting.com&d=DwMFaQ&c=LFYZ-o9_HUMeMTSQicvjIg&r=2-FskNSRL5sc9nQutgafCDIk3JbYrtcUwMwT5Zs1Tnk&m=Rgmc1JpyXlbitlUTK3B3w4xSmioN1q33FRvR_XPR19g&s=fWRvDTPKmK6YZDACsZVdLLohn0ISqs9m8VSLcF4hM6Q&e=> brian.hedst...@oamtechnologies.com<mailto:brian.hedst...@oamtechnologies.com> 720-470-7091
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