On Wed, Jun 22, 2011 at 12:30 AM, Christian Lippka <[email protected]> wrote: > As a developer I think we can learn a lot from the LO people in terms of > creating > a user feeling. I think a mistake from OOo was to actually spend more time > coding > and less time community building.
The problem is that all the community building efforts that were slowly beginning to work during Sun's governance were nullified when Oracle took over. It is you to blame that large parts just waited for a foundation to form, and sure, you can go on and whine about how bad LO and the TDF is because the moved away, and you can keep on saying that the contributions that all the volunteers did to LO in the meantime were just whitespace cleanups (which of course is not true) and belittle all the numerous contributions. Sure, continue to live in your parallel world - but don't expect to have any success with that attitude. At least there was and is progress on LibreOffice, while there was stagnation on OOo. And I fully agree - as a developer you should stop bitching around. And as Mathias wrote "go back to real work". But where is that info and support form Oracle's staff regarding the infrastructure questions? No answer to size of bugzilla-database, etc. (at lest not public/on this or the infrastructure list). What about pootle - will it come back ata ll= Stuff that is so easy to obtain for people with access, but instead you complain about how "evil" TDF and LO is? Sorry, but you really should wake up and get over with. OOo had built a great community and started to be trusted by companies and government agencies. OOo had the "foot in the door". Those who played with the idea of switching to OOo now backed off. And if open source community is lucky, the'll consider moving to LO instead of sticking with MS-Office. Now with the move to Apache you basically start over with that trust-building. What could save OOo is the name it has, but for that to work you really need to be quick in creating something that is usable for the end-user, and not just something that works for the apache process. Just removing all license conflicts won't do it. TDF/LO already did prove that it is capable of doing all the related work, apache-OOo just is getting started and already has an inferiority complex on the one hand (but considers itself as upstream on the other hand). You still have a long way to go until Apache-OOo is considere "upstream". No matter whether you have to trademark or not is irrelevant when you cannot compensate for the stuff that needs to be removed. Feel free to start bitching about LO once you got the first build from apache-OOo sources. And in case you cannot differentiate yourself: LO does not spend much time community building. The people just come to LO by themselves, press was/is positive towards TDF/LO not because we bribe them to write nice articles about us. TDF and LO is a real thing. You can get in touch, you can work on it right away. And people like that. As simple as that. TDF people have tried to communicate very positively regarding OOo's move to Apache, but IBM's Rob Weir (& others) didn't stop to attack TDF/LO in his blog and in other spots. Journalists thankfully are not stupid enough to believe anything some high-profile person writes. And you and IBM wonder why you did get the counter-reaction of the TDF-Camp (not by TDF spokespersons, but by volunteers) that just could not take that crap anymore. And last but not least about the user-feeling: Yes, you should listen to your user-base. Those are the ones who promote LO/OOo after all. Oracle did a great lesson on how to not do it with the icon-styles. That's one of the first things that LO did change, and was very, very well appreciated by the users. Some even got that far and stated that this was the reason for switching. So get down of your "I'm a developer" horse any you'll see that listening to users, that pleasing your users is not a bad thing to do. If LO is perceived to be starting faster just because the splashscreen is shown earlier, you might not consider it worth of your coding time. But that's the wrong attitude. But enough of this thread, I'll mute it once sending this message. So no worries about being "distracted from doing real work" by me again, at least not in this thread. ciao Christian
