On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 1:18 PM, Ian Lynch <ianrly...@gmail.com> wrote: > On 25 October 2011 18:01, Rob Weir <robw...@apache.org> wrote: > >> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 12:46 PM, Florian Effenberger >> <flo...@documentfoundation.org> wrote: >> > Hi, >> > >> > Rob Weir wrote on 2011-10-25 18:38: >> >> >> >> I believe it is a bad pattern to establish for collaboration. We need >> >> to recognize that TDf/LO exists as a project, and AOOo exists as a >> >> project. Once we acknowledge this then it logically follows that >> >> collaboration will occur between these two projects. Do we create a >> >> new mailing list or website, or wiki or whatever, every time we want >> >> to collaborate? Is that what we really want to start doing? If we >> >> want to coordinate on maintaining a module, we can't do it at Apache? >> >> If we want to share translation strings, we can't do it at TDF? If we >> >> want to share anything, we need to create and maintain an entirely new >> >> infrastructure for it? Sorry, that does not make sense. >> > >> > answering questions with other questions does not make sense. >> > >> > Again, given the history of this topic, I think neutral grounds make >> sense. >> > I made a proposal, and so far I have not heard any compelling reason why >> > this proposal is wrong. >> > >> > And I doubt you will name me one, because there is none. >> >> It is like making a baby. > > > Well babies are usually made from love and tenderness (unless it's a > mistake) and I don't see too much of that in this approach. At least to get > started why not do it on a neutral list? Florian has made a perfectly > reasonable case for it. Is that so much to give up just to get something > going? In terms of baby making I'd say we need some serious marriage > guidance before even talking about getting in bed together never mind > wrapping anything in latex. > > As a PPMC member I think we should show good will by going along with > Florian's suggestion and at least get one area of definite cooperation. > Where it happens is totally irrelevant. >
Then perhaps pursue one of the 6 or other options I raised for collaboration, unrelated to security. But I think we do poorly if PPMC members who are not involved with security use this list proposal as their playground for collaborative experimentation. There is a reason why we created a separate ooo-security list with only a subset of PPMC members. > > > >> If you are covered head to toe in latex, it >> ain't going to happen. You're trying to do collaboration in a >> hermetically sealed box, wearing gloves and pinching your nose so you >> don't have to smell the other party. Nothing useful will come from >> that sterile approach. Those who want to collaborate need to start >> getting dirty, working on each other's existing mailing lists (sacre >> bleu!) and acting more like hackers and less like cold war diplomats >> arguing over the shape of the negotiating table. Collaboration is not >> about neutrality. It is about collaboration. The sooner we >> acknowledge this out the sooner we'll achieve results. >> >> Again, I invite you to accept our hospitality graciously, and continue >> participation in the long-established OOo secrurityteam mailing list, >> soon to be under Apache control and hosting. I'd also love it if you >> thought of some TDF-hosted service, in some other area, where you >> could return the favor and allow us the honor of accepting your >> hospitality, and give us the opportunity to demonstrate that we have >> no problems in principle with collaborating with TDF/LO on web sites >> that they control. >> >> -Rob >> >> > Out for today, doing things that make sense. >> > >> > Florian >> > >> > -- >> > Florian Effenberger <flo...@documentfoundation.org> >> > Steering Committee and Founding Member of The Document Foundation >> > Tel: +49 8341 99660880 | Mobile: +49 151 14424108 >> > Skype: floeff | Twitter/Identi.ca: @floeff >> > >> > > -- > Ian > > Ofqual Accredited IT Qualifications (The Schools ITQ) > > www.theINGOTs.org +44 (0)1827 305940 > > The Learning Machine Limited, Reg Office, 36 Ashby Road, Tamworth, > Staffordshire, B79 8AQ. Reg No: 05560797, Registered in England and > Wales. >
