On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 6:48 PM, Michael Berry <[email protected]> wrote:
> On 7 June 2016 at 23:30, Tomas Mikula <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 6:10 PM, Michael Berry <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> On 7 June 2016 at 23:04, Tomas Mikula <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>>> What about forgetting the whole notion of a "default button" and the >>>> only >>>> effect of setting the default property to true being that the button >>>> will >>>> start as focused? >>>> >>>> So I add a question: >>>> >>>> 3) Would anyone miss the "default button"? >>>> >>> >>> Afraid I would - I find the visual difference of the default button >>> rather useful. >>> >> >> The visual difference is also what is confusing when there is also a >> focused button. Maybe they should then lose its visual distinction when a >> different button is focused (at least in Jonathan's point 2) - non-OS X >> platforms). >> > > Perhaps this is just a pure difference of opinion - I find the visual > distinction helpful because it provides a cue (from a UX perspective) as to > which button the user can be expected to hit in "normal" behaviour. This, > in my mind, is very different from the (much more subtle) cue that shows > the currently focused UI component. > If Jonathan's plan is executed: > 2) On non-OS X platforms, we change the behavior so that Enter (and Space) will fire the _focused_ key, if one is focused. then any visual cues on the "default" button are misleading (while a different button is focused, that is), since it will not be triggered on either Enter or Space. Tomas > > >> >> Tomas >> >> >>> While it would be possible to just use CSS to style it differently, this >>> (in my mind) would be a step backwards (and that's before the issues that >>> would arise from a backwards-compatibility standpoint due to removing an >>> existing property.) >>> >>> Michael >>> >>> >>>> >>>> Tomas >>>> >>>> On Tue, Jun 7, 2016 at 5:47 PM, Jonathan Giles < >>>> [email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> > Hi all, >>>> > >>>> > One thing I've been looking into recently is the issue of what the >>>> Enter >>>> > key should do when it is pushed with regards to buttons in a UI where >>>> one >>>> > of those buttons is a 'default' button. There are number of Jira >>>> issues on >>>> > this topic, and I wanted to poll the community to understand its >>>> opinions. >>>> > >>>> > The current situation is that the Enter key does not fire the focused >>>> > Button. The Enter key is reserved for firing the 'default' Button in >>>> the UI >>>> > (i.e. if someone has created a Button instance with the default >>>> property >>>> > set to true). A default button is rendered slightly differently (in >>>> Modena >>>> > it is blue for example). To fire the focused Button, the user must >>>> press >>>> > the Space key. >>>> > >>>> > Tom Schindl filed a bug (JDK-8139510) that is a good example of the >>>> > 'problem' this creates. In the bug report, a dialog is shown to the >>>> user. >>>> > In the dialog is an OK button and a Cancel button. The OK button has >>>> been >>>> > made the 'default' button. Regardless of which button has focus, the >>>> Enter >>>> > key always fires the OK button. The only way to fire the Cancel >>>> button is >>>> > via the Space key. This can be very confusing for users who have >>>> tabbed >>>> > specifically to the 'Cancel' button and then pressed the Enter key, >>>> only to >>>> > find they unwittingly fired the 'OK' action. >>>> > >>>> > To me this has always been a little counter-intuitive, because of my >>>> > heritage as a long-time Windows user. I believe Linux is much the >>>> same as >>>> > Windows. For others who grew up on Mac, I'm less sure on what people >>>> expect >>>> > (but it seems to be that the Enter key fires the default button, not >>>> the >>>> > focused button, i.e. JavaFX current behavior matches what is expected >>>> on OS >>>> > X). >>>> > >>>> > What I'm proposing we do is to change the behavior as follows: >>>> > >>>> > 1) On OS X we do not change behavior at all - we keep the current >>>> 'Enter >>>> > means default' and 'Space means focus' semantics. >>>> > >>>> > 2) On non-OS X platforms, we change the behavior so that Enter (and >>>> Space) >>>> > will fire the _focused_ key, if one is focused. If no Button is >>>> focused >>>> > (e.g. focus is in a TextField, etc), then Enter will work as it >>>> currently >>>> > does and fire the default button, if one is specified. In short, >>>> default >>>> > buttons will still be rendered blue to hint to the user that they are >>>> the >>>> > default button, but they will be less prevalently fired by Enter key >>>> > presses - only when they also have focus. >>>> > >>>> > The two questions that I have are: >>>> > >>>> > 1) Will this confuse users when there is a behavior change (and >>>> > presumably, this change will be made in JDK 9 and not backported to >>>> JDK 8). >>>> > If it will confuse users, is it still the right thing to do? >>>> > >>>> > 2) Do we want to have different behaviors for OS X and non-OS X? I'm a >>>> > newly inducted member into the cult of Mac, and I don't yet have all >>>> my >>>> > bearings sorted out, so I don't have a strong opinion here. >>>> > >>>> > Your thoughts, as always, are appreciated. >>>> > -- Jonathan >>>> > >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Thanks, >>> >>> Michael >>> >>> >>> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail> >>> Virus-free. >>> www.avast.com >>> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail> >>> <#m_-8105136466737180413_m_1700382838741580870_m_-3404683945119215455_DDB4FAA8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> >>> >> >> > > > -- > Thanks, > > Michael >
