Hi Chris, Well said. Your description of a legitimate use is spot on. Certainly there can be illegitimate uses, but that in and of itself doesn't negate the fact that legitimate uses exist. If I create a thing on my grid, and this tool allows me to take that thing over to Fleep's grid, that seems pretty legitimate to me.
A tool that allows for the convenient management of allowable inventory across grids is sorely needed. That a users things should travel with the user seems to my tiny brain as being a no-brainer :-). Doug Danforth On Sun, Nov 18, 2012 at 2:31 PM, Fleep Tuque <[email protected]> wrote: > Regarding legitimate use cases: > > It would be a perfectly legitimate use for someone to download any and all > content they have received on FleepGrid and then import that content into > any other grid. Every item available to another user via $0 sale or "take > a copy" on my grid is CC licensed for such use (to the best of my > knowledge) and there would be nothing illegal, immoral, or unethical about > it. In fact, I encourage it! > > Likewise, it would be a perfectly legitimate use for someone to download > all 500+ items I have created and listed on the FleepGrid webshop, which > are primarily in IAR format, and then upload those items to any other grid. > Right now, as far as I know, the only way to do that is through console > access, which means only grid owners can really use the items I put on the > web, not end users. That's due to a technical limitation of existing > tools, not my intent. My intent is for anyone to be able to use them. If > I understand Snowcrash's description correctly, his tool would make that > possible for any end user of a grid, which in fact would not only be a > legitimate use of the tool, but a wonderful and extremely helpful addition > for those of us who opensource our content and make it available in IAR > format for transport. > > I really don't mean to beat a dead horse, but those are legitimate uses. > To say there is NO legitimate use of such a tool is simply not true. What > is true is that there could be both legitimate and illegitimate uses. And > I agree Snowcrash and any other developers should do their very best to > safeguard against that where possible. But you can't argue that no > legitimate use case exists because I've just given several. My desire to > create content and share it freely with whoever wants to use it is as > legitimate as any other content creator's desires, and ditto for any > law-abiding end user who wishes to use that content in an easy, convenient, > legal way. > > > Regarding the concept of "my inventory" (lowercase): > > I agree with Snowcrash that the concept of "my inventory" is the mental > construct that the vast majority of virtual world users have. Once I have > personally verified the license of an opensource item and have gained > access to it (currently by downloading the IAR or XML file to my local > computer), then I consider that file to be "mine" (or my licensed copy if > you prefer) to use as I wish, on any grid I wish. The creator said I > could. Great! Except the ability to actually use that item on any grid I > wish requires me to upload it over and over each time I go to a new grid. > And for IAR items, the only portable format that fully preserves an item, > I can only upload it if I have console access to the simulator - which of > course I do not have access to on any grids but my own. That is not an > ideal situation at all. I have an inventory of stuff that is mine to use, > my inventory, but using it on every grid I visit is at the moment an > exceedingly cumbersome process at best, and maybe not even possible at all > unless I have console access. > > A tool that would allow me to upload all the legally licensed XML and IAR > files I am currently storing on my local computer to a third party service, > that would hold those files for me, and then magically import them into any > grid I visit without me having to manually do it item by item myself would > be a godsend - and perfectly legal, legitimate, ethical, and proper. I > know every XML and IAR file on my local computer is licensed for such use > and I would use such a tool with no hesitation at all, and would probably > want to kiss the developer who made it because it would save me an enormous > amount of time and effort. > > > Regarding third party inventory services: > > So let's say 20 reputable opensource content creators got together and > decided to pool our resources to make a repository of content available, > and we each had 500 items to contribute. Think Linda Kellie, who has the > most open permissions of any Opensim creator I know, or Vanish Seriath of > Opensim Creations, etc. So now we have a repository of 10,000 items that > are legally licensed from trusted sources that can be used on any grid. > Would you really argue the ideal situation is that each user should > manually download each item from that repository and then each user should > manually upload each item to each and every grid every time they want to > use something from it? Surely not, that's crazy. But that's pretty much > the current situation. > > The ideal situation would be to have my inventory of legally licensed > freebie and purchased content (if it was licensed for such use) hosted not > on each grid, but somewhere else, and accessible to me no matter what grid > I travel to without me having to do any uploading at all. When I log on to > a grid, some established protocol talks to my inventory (or inventories, I > can imagine multiple services/sources), displays it as a folder when I open > my inventory in the GUI, and makes a local copy of an item only when I rez > it out into the world, or wear it, or whatever. Or something like that. > For freebie licensed content, perhaps grids subscribe to the third party > inventory repository and provide it as a folder in the library for every > user of their grid, or.. I dunno! I can imagine many permutations. > > I am not a developer, so I don't fully understand all the mechanisms and > protocols that exist or could exist to make that kind of functionality > possible. But in general, it seems like Snowcrash's tool is trying to > implement some version of that concept, and I for one am very interested in > seeing how it might be implemented in a legal and ethical way. It would > solve what I view as one of the biggest obstacles to Opensim adoption - > lack of easy availability and portability of known, legally licensed, > trusted content. > > > Regarding opensource content creators and the need for better mechanisms > to share opensource content: > > I think Linda, Vanish, and I might be three largest web-based opensource > content providers at the moment, but there may be more that I don't know > about. I obviously can't speak for them, but for myself, I spend an > _enormous_ amount of time, energy, and what amateur skill I possess not > just making items for the community, but countless additional hours > packaging them up, indexing them, loading them onto a website, and doing my > best to make it easy for people to actually port them wherever they want > and _use_ them. > > Since I am not a coder or a programmer, I unfortunately can't contribute > to the development of the Opensim code itself. Creating openly licensed > content represents my attempt to contribute to the Opensim community in > another way. Which is why it is quite sad to me that for all the countless > hours of effort I've dedicated to making these resources available to > people, in the hopes of making a significant positive contribution to the > Opensim community, the current technical limitations prevents the vast > majority of end users from being able to use my content at all! > > If Snowcrash is trying to resolve that problem, I am behind that effort > 100%, even if I share everyone's concerns about illegitimate uses and the > need to protect others rights, and sincerely hope that those issues and > concerns can be addressed, too. But I can't agree there's no legitimate > need or use for a tool such as this - from my perspective, there is in fact > a great need for it. > > . . . > > I do apologize, both for the tl;dr length of this post and because I've > posted an awful lot in this thread, far more than I usually do. Clearly I > feel passionately about the topic. Maybe I'll try to take a backseat for a > bit to make sure I'm not drowning out other voices and to think more about > all of the possible implications of a tool with this functionality. And > while, for the purposes of this discussion, I am taking a strong position > on the potential benefits for opensource creators and law-abiding end > users, I hope it's clear that I genuinely understand, respect, and agree > with many of the concerns that have been raised as well. I want all > content creators' and grid owners' rights to be respected, not just my own. > > > Sincerely, > > - Chris/Fleep > > > >
_______________________________________________ Opensim-users mailing list [email protected] https://lists.berlios.de/mailman/listinfo/opensim-users
