It is a learning experience/opportunity, and next time it will be smoother. Also, almost without exceptions, someone who is working on fixing something get answers when they ask, often quickly, because everyone here wants new people to succeed and become more productive over time.
Achim, Guilaume and others were not the originators of Pax Web either. They dug into what we had at that time, and made improvements (or was it a complete rewrite?)... I don't recall how much help they needed, but if they needed it, "we" (who were more active then) tried our best to help us much as we could. And I am sure this tradition still runs in this community, and many others "out there"... Cheers Niclas Niclas On Sun, Sep 25, 2016 at 6:15 PM, iJava <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Achim > > If no one of the developers do it in the nearest future then I will spend > about 20 hours trying to fix it. > It is obvious that it will be much more difficult for me because I don't > know the inner architecture of pax-cdi > and pax-web. > > But firstly I need Guillaume Nodet update pax-cdi 1.x branch to align > with pax-web 6.x. > > Best regards, > > > воскресенье, 25 сентября 2016 г., 12:20:02 UTC+3 пользователь Achim > Nierbeck написал: >> >> Alexander, >> >> I still fear you miss the point of Open Source Software. And what the >> free in free software means. [1] >> It isn't about free as in free beer it is about free as in freedom to >> read the sources, about the freedom to participate. >> >> And as I already stated previously to you. It certainly isn't a one-way >> street where on the one end the "stupid" developers reside and the other >> end is a consumer that just needs to bark loud enough. It's a give and >> take, so think more about what you can give the community[2]. >> How about you take some of your private time and try to fix the issue >> which bothers you so much in your productive environment? >> Maybe your employer, who obviously earns money while using this open >> source software, gives you some time to fix the issue? >> Or as Niclas already stated, find someone to do it for you and pay that >> person. >> >> regards, Achim >> >> >> [1] - http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.en.html >> [2] - http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/community >> >> 2016-09-25 9:04 GMT+02:00 iJava <[email protected]>: >> >>> Hi Niclas >>> >>> Thank you for detailed answers to my questions. Now I understand how >>> this community is managed - >>> to say more correctly how this community is unmanaged. >>> >>> To tell the truth it is a very strange for me - but this is of course my >>> private opinion. I believe >>> that bad plan is better then the absence of the plan. It is clear why - >>> because with bad >>> plan actions at least are coordinated. >>> >>> I am not a contributor and "don't dare" to make any suggestions. But >>> about "dare" to use open sources >>> projects. You know - I am developer, I develop some products and use >>> other products. When I use some >>> products it is clear that I want to know the future of the product, And >>> it is quite common to see the roadmap >>> of the project. Please, note it is quite common and in open source >>> projects. >>> >>> By the way it would be helpful not only for users who "dare" to use the >>> products. It would be helpful and for >>> developers and they would have the questions like in this thread >>> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/ops4j/q8A4qniAtCg >>> >>> Best regards, >>> >>> воскресенье, 25 сентября 2016 г., 2:34:03 UTC+3 пользователь Niclas >>> Hedhman написал: >>>> >>>> Alexander, >>>> >>>> To the question on how things are prioritized; It is very simple. The >>>> person who wants to work on an issue places the priority on the issue. >>>> Before anyone puts down his/her own name on the issue, it should actually >>>> be marked "not prioritized" and if you disagree, simply change it, assign >>>> the issue to yourself and work on it. There is a "Participation" in the >>>> name here for a reason. >>>> >>>> Perhaps so much time has passed that you and other relatively new >>>> people to this community are unaware of the early principles and purpose of >>>> OPS4J, the "Flock of Birds" metaphor, the "If you are committed enough to >>>> create a Jira issue, you are a committer". It was created as a pure code >>>> collaboration platform[1] among peers, without hierarchies and as it turned >>>> out[2] without planned governance. It was partly a reaction to the "Avalon >>>> break-down"[3] and "Barrier to Entry" that were discussed at Apache at the >>>> time (~2005). >>>> People like Toni, Achim, Pieber and many more started showing up with >>>> patches, and I bet many were surprised to know that they had to apply their >>>> own patches, because the rest of us were either too busy or too lazy to do >>>> it. Last time I checked (quite a few years ago), there had been >150 >>>> contributors and ~600 subscribers to this list. That is about 25% had an >>>> itch to fix, which is waaayyyy higher than places like Apache or Eclipse. >>>> >>>> So, I know that it can be quite frustrating when something doesn't work >>>> to one's expectations, and I am also aware that everyone doesn't have the >>>> skills to fix it, but those people generally don't dare to use open source >>>> directly, because they know (or should know) that there is no "support to >>>> call"[4], and they typically pay people to handle it. What IS common >>>> though, is that people (like myself) have the skills, but think that they >>>> don't have time, or that "someone else ought to fix it soon enough", and >>>> meanwhile one just hangs in there... IF it is truly a Blocker, then one >>>> needs to drop everything else and indeed fix it. If other things are more >>>> important, then it can NOT be a Blocker, possibly not even a Major issue. >>>> >>>> I am sorry if this comes across as harsh, but OPS4J is a "do-acracy". >>>> Those who do the work, decides what work to be done. MANY of the >>>> contributors here, are WAY MORE accommodating to user's requests than >>>> initially anticipated, and all the KUDOS to them. But maybe, just maybe, >>>> that has increased the expectations a tad too high. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> [1] Back then (~2005-2009), we ran our own servers, with mailing lists, >>>> Subversion, Confluence, Jira, Bamboo, Jenkins, Crowd and what not. An >>>> automated process, so that if you signed up on Crowd, you got commit rights >>>> automatically in Subversion. Back then, the managed services that we enjoy >>>> today, simply didn't exist. Keeping that alive was actually more work than >>>> we had expected, and eventually we compromised the "auto committer" system, >>>> in favor of externally managed services. >>>> >>>> [2] In the very early days, a governance model was established, but it >>>> fell apart because I think we all felt that it wasn't needed. There might >>>> be pages still discussing this on the Wiki, but those can safely be >>>> removed. >>>> >>>> [3] In Apache Avalon, a lot of people got involved in "you must do X", >>>> "you can't do Y", but those people didn't do the work, but based their >>>> opinions on either past contributions, or that they were a user depending >>>> on the codebase. The community got fractured like politics, and it wasn't >>>> fun. It got to the point where one release candidate contained a single >>>> constructor Javadoc edit (and nothing else), and I was accused of breaking >>>> compatibility by outsiders, who had no interest in working on the project. >>>> >>>> [4] If you need "paid support" on OPS4J, contact me privately and I >>>> will try to give you some choices. >>>> >>>> >>>> Niclas >>>> >>>> On Sat, Sep 24, 2016 at 10:17 PM, iJava <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi all, >>>>> >>>>> I am also user of this list and let me add my two cents. >>>>> To tell the truth, I don't understand how the developers of pax-web >>>>> set priorities for the issues. >>>>> >>>>> I did report about the problem https://ops4j1.jira.com/browse >>>>> /PAXWEB-760 >>>>> How important is this problem - this problem doesn't let update bundle >>>>> of the site >>>>> which is in production. This is core functionality as it is used >>>>> constantly. In our company >>>>> it would be issue number one - there is nothing more important then >>>>> core functionality. >>>>> >>>>> For example - if you develop a text editor and it can't save files you >>>>> don't >>>>> think about button hover animation. Could anyone explain what >>>>> principles >>>>> are followed when next issues are chosen. Is there some roadmap of the >>>>> project? >>>>> I already asked about plans but unfortunately didn't get any answers. >>>>> >>>>> Best regards >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> -- >>>>> ------------------ >>>>> OPS4J - http://www.ops4j.org - [email protected] >>>>> >>>>> --- >>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>> Groups "OPS4J" group. >>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer >>>> http://zest.apache.org - New Energy for Java >>>> >>> -- >>> -- >>> ------------------ >>> OPS4J - http://www.ops4j.org - [email protected] >>> >>> --- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "OPS4J" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> >> Apache Member >> Apache Karaf <http://karaf.apache.org/> Committer & PMC >> OPS4J Pax Web <http://wiki.ops4j.org/display/paxweb/Pax+Web/> Committer >> & Project Lead >> blog <http://notizblog.nierbeck.de/> >> Co-Author of Apache Karaf Cookbook <http://bit.ly/1ps9rkS> >> >> Software Architect / Project Manager / Scrum Master >> >> -- > -- > ------------------ > OPS4J - http://www.ops4j.org - [email protected] > > --- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "OPS4J" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer http://zest.apache.org - New Energy for Java -- -- ------------------ OPS4J - http://www.ops4j.org - [email protected] --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "OPS4J" group. 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