Good nuance. Thanks. Esther
Le 2013-09-30 à 13:46, John Watkins a écrit : > I think we get into a lot of trouble when we start to call things that humans > make up "natural." The Law and the Principles are not natural; they are > human constructs. They may have been created to mimic "natural" emergent > systems of self-organizing, but they are not natural. My two cents worth. > > John > > On Sep 30, 2013, at 10:42 AM, Esther Matte wrote: > >> Interesting thread! >> >> From my perspective, the law and principles are natural. However, they need >> to be mentioned to create the container for people to get reacquainted with >> that very deep nature that has been covered, constrained, forgotten after >> many, many layers of rules, habits and fears were created in modern society. >> When you don't mention the law and principles, what you get is just a huge >> brainstorm session without any individual or collective responsibility. >> >> That's my two cents... and I'm looking forward to the Oct. 14 conversation >> about Agile. >> >> Cheers! >> >> >> Esther Matte >> Discover - Engage - Accomplish >> Nurturing Life in Organizations >> 450-955-1693 >> www.esthermatte.com >> >> Le 2013-09-30 à 13:31, Daniel Mezick a écrit : >> >>> I request help and guidance. Will you help me understand the rule of the >>> Open Space meeting format? >>> >>> If the 1 law & the 4/5 principles are natural and self-evident, I am >>> confused about the need to mention them whatsoever. >>> >>> If the 1 law and the 4/5 principles are not natural and not self-evident, I >>> am confused about how mentioning them is optional. >>> >>> The 1 "law" (quotes) and "4/5 principles" (quotes again) are either >>> self-evident, or they are not. I wonder which is the reality. >>> >>> See also: >>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_law >>> http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_rights >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On 9/30/13 8:05 AM, Harrison Owen wrote: >>>> Dan – I have to agree with Lisa. As said multiple times before, the 5 >>>> principles and the Law are descriptive and not prescriptive. Or at least >>>> that is the way they popped into my head: simple observations of what was >>>> transpiring, as opposed to directions concerning what should be taking >>>> place. I have always said “Principles” and “Law” with a smile, because if >>>> you really think about it, they are neither (principle or law). More like, >>>> “funny things that happen on the way to the future.” There is an essential >>>> humor, sense of fun in Open Space – and if we ever lose it, we begin to >>>> take things much too seriously L I call it High Play. >>>> >>>> Harrison >>>> >>>> Harrison Owen >>>> 7808 River Falls Dr. >>>> Potomac, MD 20854 >>>> USA >>>> >>>> 189 Beaucaire Ave. (summer) >>>> Camden, Maine 04843 >>>> >>>> Phone 301-365-2093 >>>> (summer) 207-763-3261 >>>> >>>> www.openspaceworld.com >>>> www.ho-image.com (Personal Website) >>>> To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of >>>> OSLIST Go >>>> to:http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org >>>> >>>> From: [email protected] >>>> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Lisa Heft >>>> Sent: Monday, September 30, 2013 3:22 AM >>>> To: World wide Open Space Technology email list >>>> Subject: [OSList] (was) Open Space in schools - now: OST boundaries? >>>> constraints? >>>> >>>> Dan - I have taken the liberty of adjusting the title of this topic to >>>> more closely fit the changed content. >>>> >>>> And: I look forward to hearing how others respond… >>>> >>>> 1/ I see the Law and Principles and *invitations* not as constraints. >>>> >>>> 2/ And not 'required' as in - some of us do not use the 5th Principle at >>>> all. However, the saying, inviting and simple explanation of these >>>> invitations help to create the structure (as there is a structure, just >>>> not the structure that a lot of people have experienced in meetings) / to >>>> create the container. What I mean by that is that I have observed that to >>>> not offer the invitation of the principles and law (even in a group of >>>> people who completely know and do Open Space) is not inviting presence and >>>> possibility in the same way. So different dynamics then occur. >>>> >>>> And in saying that offering these invitations and explaining this process >>>> help to create the container, I mean a living, breathing, nutrient-rich >>>> container, perhaps similar to some containers like cellular walls, a >>>> bird's nest, a lake, a poem, or a wisp of vapor… which have some form >>>> within which there is flow. >>>> >>>> 3/ I notice that some super-good OST facilitators can use more words to >>>> explain things, and some use less. And the experience can be amazing. In >>>> my observation, it is not the amount of words, it is the complete true >>>> understanding of inviting Opening Circle and agenda co-creation (which >>>> include a brief explanation of principles and law and process), and >>>> getting / staying out of the way so the participants can do their own >>>> work, see their own patterns, feel their own co-leadership, and so on. >>>> >>>> What do others think? >>>> >>>> Lisa >>>> >>>> On Sep 29, 2013, at 10:53 PM, Daniel Mezick <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> Lisa says: >>>> "... >>>> The other thing is that for any kind of facilitation, I would not name >>>> boundaries or constraints. It sets peoples' minds in the framework of >>>> boundaries and constraints - rather than opportunities and possibilities. >>>> Like 'think outside the box' - you are still thinking…of the box! when / >>>> because someone says that. " >>>> >>>> Dan says: >>>> I notice that: >>>> 1/ the 1 Law and 5 Principles of OST are constraints-in-fact. Are they >>>> not? >>>> 2/ we are required to describe these as OST Facilitators; at least, >>>> according to the OST Guide. Right? >>>> 3/ the general idea for the Facilitator is, "the less said the better". >>>> No? >>>> >>>> I think OST is a most wonderful game. >>>> http://newtechusa.net/agile/how-games-deliver-happiness-learning/ >>>> >>>> Dan >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> OSList mailing list >>>> To post send emails to [email protected] >>>> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] >>>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below: >>>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org >>> >>> -- >>> Daniel Mezick, President >>> New Technology Solutions Inc. >>> (203) 915 7248 (cell) >>> Bio. Blog. Twitter. >>> Examine my new book: The Culture Game : Tools for the Agile Manager. >>> Explore Agile Team Training and Coaching. >>> Explore the Agile Boston Community. >>> _______________________________________________ >>> OSList mailing list >>> To post send emails to [email protected] >>> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] >>> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below: >>> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> OSList mailing list >> To post send emails to [email protected] >> To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] >> To subscribe or manage your subscription click below: >> http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org > > _______________________________________________ > OSList mailing list > To post send emails to [email protected] > To unsubscribe send an email to [email protected] > To subscribe or manage your subscription click below: > http://lists.openspacetech.org/listinfo.cgi/oslist-openspacetech.org
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